Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[URL="http://www.mercuryserver.com/forums/showthread.php?79906-terror-bombing-attempt-on-plane....&highlight=kurt+haskell"]http://www.mercuryserver.com/forums/showthread.php?79906-terror-bombing-attempt-on-plane....&highlight=kurt+haskell[/URL]

Go through the thread.

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

Also the CIA admits they like making videos to put out as propaganda.

[URL="http://blog.washingtonpost.com/spy-talk/2010/05/cia_group_had_wacky_ideas_to_d.html"]http://blog.washingtonpost.com/spy-talk/2010/05/cia_group_had_wacky_ideas_to_d.html[/URL]

They were going to make a video before going into Iraq of a Saddam look a like having gay sex with a teenage boy. They were going to circulate it in Iraq to discredit him with his people.

Also that video where Bin Laden takes credit for the attacks was a fake.. That is common knowledge as well.

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

President Obama is going to be on 60 Minutes tonight talking about this.

[url]http://www.cbs.com/primetime/60_minutes/[/url]

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=runningman;954251][URL="http://www.mercuryserver.com/forums/showthread.php?79906-terror-bombing-attempt-on-plane....&highlight=kurt+haskell"]http://www.mercuryserver.com/forums/showthread.php?79906-terror-bombing-attempt-on-plane....&highlight=kurt+haskell[/URL]

Go through the thread.[/QUOTE]

so this Kurt Haskell dude is a lawyer and this makes his story more credible ? at the end of the day he saw 2 american guys escorting a man without a passport onto a flight and immediately came to the conclusion that the 2 american guys were CIA officials ? i,m quite sure of a couple of things here

1: those american guys had a huge sign above their heads saying " HI WERE THE CIA " so in fact Kurt Haskell must be correct in assuming that these were US officials due to the big sign... at the end of the day he really has no evidence to who both these american guys were and as a lawyer i,m actually quite shocked that he made these claims without actual hard evidence. can u actually show me compelling evidence that his claims are justified ?

2: the CIA are not stupid, why risk taking a bomb into a foreign country with the risk of it being defective and actually exploding while they are in the company of a man going through a foreign airport with it strapped to him.. the potential back lash of this happening would have dire consequence for all involved.. i,ve seen countries going to war for less.

3: I'm sure the CIA wouldn't want to draw attention to both themselves and the man with the bomb by not giving him a passport to complete the operation if it was in fact a covert operation...and i,m sure the dutch authorities don't have camera's in their airports so their security services won't have footage of these so called "CIA operatives" passing through the airport and of course there wouldn't be a complete shit storm between the dutch and americans...christ that would of been all over the news more than the actual event would of LOL

4:Umar Farouk Abdul Mutallab as a man on a mission where he knew he was going to die in the name of jihad or whatever would sell his soul to the enemy and carry out a mission for them to make it harder for other attacks to be performed by al qaeda oh and knowing of course that the CIA had given him a defective bomb then go and burn his the nut sack off. but i,m sure you could say thats he turned @ the last minute and the CIA told him that permanently disfiguring himself for life is the only way out.

i,m sorry m8 but i find these stories completely absurd and completely hideous as they all really surface from speculation without any real hard data or evidence but hey i suppose they sell papers and make good tv though huh ?

my personal view on this one is that al qaeda are becoming more and more clever in planning out their attacks as they have had to since security has tightened up and the worlds forces close in on them... they are like terrorists the world has never seen before, extremely cunning and particularly snide, well funded and with exceptionally clever guys planning out stuff for them.

I also think they are a little shell shocked by the response of the worlds forces in tackling them and i think this is why you see fewer attacks due to the fear of exposing themselves in the process and ALSO why you are seeing cunning well planned out attacks when they actually do 1.

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=runningman;954256]Also the CIA admits they like making videos to put out as propaganda.

[URL="http://blog.washingtonpost.com/spy-talk/2010/05/cia_group_had_wacky_ideas_to_d.html"]http://blog.washingtonpost.com/spy-talk/2010/05/cia_group_had_wacky_ideas_to_d.html[/URL]

They were going to make a video before going into Iraq of a Saddam look a like having gay sex with a teenage boy. They were going to circulate it in Iraq to discredit him with his people.

Also that video where Bin Laden takes credit for the attacks was a fake.. That is common knowledge as well.[/QUOTE]

no offence m8 ( and this is NOT a personal attack ) but if u keep going the way ur going with this the threads going to end up in fake moon landing links and all sorts... yea the CIA probably thought of something as radical as this but have u ever asked yourself why they didn't go through with it ? it would of been easy to carry it out.

again i think this is a completely absurd idea probably born from some sort of roumer flying around in slightly paranoid minds a group of people who doubt... i want to see things like this coming from the word of a current CIA operative as complete evidence not bull shit news channels and newspapers and of course internet information...nothing can be verified as correct within these circles

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

So according to you how do you stop al qaeda?

Do we kill all the muslims like we did to the Indians here in America? Or do we just strip everyone of their rights? Because the more "clever" they get means they are cleverly working the system.

So which is it? And I would like you to answer because I want to know which one of your final solutions you are for.

Also don't take this as attack but are you really Scottish?

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

Why would you question Kurt Haskells credibility but not question how he got on the plane without a passport in a post 9/11 airport system?

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=runningman;954306]So according to you how do you stop al qaeda?

Do we kill all the muslims like we did to the Indians here in America? Or do we just strip everyone of their rights? Because the more "clever" they get means they are cleverly working the system.

So which is it? And I would like you to answer because I want to know which one of your final solutions you are for.

Also don't take this as attack but are you really Scottish?[/QUOTE]

lol yea m8 i,m scottish born and bread :P lived here all my days ;)

i have no definitive answer as to how u stop al qaeda but i think the way things are going right now are a good step forward as they seem a little rattled by the response as i said previously..eventually people will get the message about how dangerous it is to join such groups so i think there are or will be less people signing up...breaking them down in that way is certainly a good start, eventually ( probably a long time ) things will fizzle to a point where the remaining ones will be suitably easy to deal with, the security services really don't know just how large or small al qaeda are.

i dont think they will ever be able to eliminate the hate and i,m sure the brits are well knowledged on this with their experience in ireland.

i,m sorry but where does killing anything that moves come into this ? its only a small amount of the muslim population that are radicalised and its finding out who is and who is not that's the hard part and why its costing so much money in the process...info like that doesn't come cheaply.

like i said i do not have a final solution.

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=runningman;954307]Why would you question Kurt Haskells credibility but not question how he got on the plane without a passport in a post 9/11 airport system?[/QUOTE]

kinda already touched on this earlier running, my thoughts on it that al qaeda are starting to not only get correct info on how security officials operate but also are clever enough to carry out this knowledge in their own covert operations. trickery being the key word here

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

never mind

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[video=youtube;LpJ3yzUPbL0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LpJ3yzUPbL0[/video]

and this is just a guy on the internet....go on try and tell me guys like the CIA and other guys don't train people to do this

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impersonator[/url]

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-south-asia-13318372[/url]

this is quite an interesting read

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[url]http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/05/06/bin.laden.qaeda.comment/?hpt=T1[/url]

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/VSVI6.png[/IMG]

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

cia

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=res0nat0r;954520]cia[/QUOTE]

hell yea... military spec cgi :lol:

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=thebanned1;954357][url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-south-asia-13318372[/url]

this is quite an interesting read[/QUOTE]

[bullshit by me]reading this brought some further thoughts to me last night with regards to whether the ISI knew he was there or not, i think yes they did and although this might sound a bit daft i,ll try and explain myself...

ok although osama's location was said to have been known since august last year they didn't really act upon it for quite a while, there could of been a few reasons why this happened and in my mind i,m almost convinced that it was the ISI that found him, ok heres why[/bullshit by me]

a: its been said that navy seals had life like models of the compound they used to train for the mission!! now how would they have known what the building was like inside? its not as if they could just run up to the local architect and ask him for the building plans! they would not have been able to build a complete replica of the building from satalite images alone! so from that point of view its obvious thats there was some sort of watch put on the place to what ever degree.

b: when the mission was carried out the seals flew 2 helicopters ( although under radar ) and had a 38 minute gun battle 1000 yards from a huge military base...if u think about it surely the noise of both the helicopters and also the gunshots would of been noticed in the camp as i,m sure the sound would of travelled that far...so why didn't they gather a group of troops and go out to the location to see what was going on...surely an event of this kind is a serious security threat when its carried out so close to a military base ? and why did it take 30 minutes for the pakistani's to scramble jets ? and also how did the americans know that jets were scrambled after all there was supposedly only a group of seals and a 2 helicopter pilots in the area ? ( actually saying that now i,m sure there would of been other seals/cia operatives in the area )

[bullshit by me]c: the pakistani government is actually shitting itself for fear of backlash from al qaeda especially knowing that they were in fact part of the capture of their "glorious" leader... i,m sure if this was confirmed then you would see a shit load of attacks being carried out as revenge on the pakistani people? which kinda bring me to another reason i think this was all part of the plan and another reason why the attack wasn't carried out sooner than it was because the americans would of known this and put their spin doctors on the case to cook up some sort of get out for pakistan...imo i think this was all planned right from the start and this is why i think the ISI knew about this all the time[/bullshit by me]

d: the above story bring up another valid point about the legalities of the mission and i think this is another reason why it took so long was the fact that the americans had to go through the proper legal procedure when planning the mission

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=res0nat0r;954520]cia[/QUOTE]

:lol:

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=res0nat0r;954520]cia[/QUOTE]

you gonna post 40 0f them at 30 second intervals

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

I'm setting up a bot b/c it pisses you off so much. Let you know when its online.

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=res0nat0r;954582]I'm setting up a bot b/c it pisses you off so much. Let you know when its online.[/QUOTE]

You saying you are deliberately trying to antagonise someone Res0?

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

....

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=thebanned1;954301]so this Kurt Haskell dude is a lawyer and this makes his story more credible ? at the end of the day he saw 2 american guys escorting a man without a passport onto a flight and immediately came to the conclusion that the 2 american guys were CIA officials ? i,m quite sure of a couple of things here

1: those american guys had a huge sign above their heads saying " HI WERE THE CIA " so in fact Kurt Haskell must be correct in assuming that these were US officials due to the big sign... at the end of the day he really has no evidence to who both these american guys were and as a lawyer i,m actually quite shocked that he made these claims without actual hard evidence. can u actually show me compelling evidence that his claims are justified ?[/QUOTE]

This story broke originally on The Boston Times on the day of the event. What I find strange is it was not mentioned on one single news channel in the UK. The only way he could justify his claims would be to get some footage from the Airport in Amsterdam, however the US government have made no statement about his claim. However you have made the mistake RM has, he's saying its the CIA you're saying its Al Qaeda and there is very little evidence to suggest either.

[QUOTE=thebanned1;954301] 2: the CIA are not stupid, why risk taking a bomb into a foreign country with the risk of it being defective and actually exploding while they are in the company of a man going through a foreign airport with it strapped to him.. the potential back lash of this happening would have dire consequence for all involved.. i,ve seen countries going to war for less. [/QUOTE]

Personally I don't think this bomb was ever intended it go off. Both the pants bomber and the shoe bomber's devices failed to detonate. Both these men where suffering from degrees of mental illness. I think they where both manipulated into doing the acts they attempted. The devices failed to detonate you tell us "al qaeda extremely cunning and particularly snide, well funded and with exceptionally clever guys" but on 2 attempts they could not make an explosive that could detonate. For this to be true they are at best incompetent and maybe don't give a shit. So who benefited from the acts? I think all these 2 act did was sustain fear amongst the general public.

[QUOTE=thebanned1;954301]4:Umar Farouk Abdul Mutallab as a man on a mission where he knew he was going to die in the name of jihad or whatever would sell his soul to the enemy and carry out a mission for them to make it harder for other attacks to be performed by al qaeda oh and knowing of course that the CIA had given him a defective bomb then go and burn his the nut sack off. but i,m sure you could say thats he turned @ the last minute and the CIA told him that permanently disfiguring himself for life is the only way out.[/QUOTE]

I think if this was a genuine attack they would have used one of their super solders and not some bloke how had some health issues

[QUOTE=thebanned1;954301] my personal view on this one is that al qaeda are becoming more and more clever in planning out their attacks as they have had to since security has tightened up and the worlds forces close in on them... they are like terrorists the world has never seen before, extremely cunning and particularly snide, well funded and with exceptionally clever guys planning out stuff for them.

I also think they are a little shell shocked by the response of the worlds forces in tackling them and i think this is why you see fewer attacks due to the fear of exposing themselves in the process and ALSO why you are seeing cunning well planned out attacks when they actually do 1.[/QUOTE]

I think if there is some network of terrorists they are a best incompetent and maybe don’t give a fuck.

The Printer Cartridge along with the so called Shoe Bomber and the Pants Bomber stories are even more bizarre. You would think this underground network would be able to make a bomb that was actually able to detonate. I think the bombs where never intended to go off. The where staged just so the government could sustain this idea that terror is still out there. If there hadn’t been these so called acts of terror. I think a lot of people would be asking a lot more questions about their governments.

You only have to look into the history of the leader of the so called 7/7 bomber. He was picked up by the US Government then released because he was working for MI5. On the day of the bombings he left the UK. I think he manipulated these 4 people into carry out the attack and I’m not sure if they all knew what they where doing.

Now the terrorists have moved from Martyrdom to parcel bombing we should expect more incidents and on a bigger scale. Why send 4 ink cartridges when you can send 400? Why post them from the other side of the world when you can post them internally. Why keep targeting planes when you can target trains, buses or shopping malls a lot easier? You only have to look at the terror campaign that the IRA used in the 70’s through to the 90’s. We had car bombs used on shopping malls, mortar attacks on airports, assassinations of police, the armed forces, prison guards and politicians. But these days all we see are bungled bombing attempts.

9/11 was probably the biggest act of terrorism ever, but how did the terrorist go from something that must have took a lot of planning to the pants bomber

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=thebanned1;954592]didnt wanna antagonise .[/QUOTE]

I wouldn't worry I can see all your edited posts:lol:

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=chunky;954600]I wouldn't worry I can see all your edited posts:lol:[/QUOTE]

:lol:

fuck it :lol:

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=chunky;954599]9/11 was probably the biggest act of terrorism ever, but how did the terrorist go from something that must have took a lot of planning to the pants bomber[/QUOTE]

Those two guys were just some idiots trying to kill people because they thought the US was the enemy. Sure they may have flown overseas to meet some dudes and talk about a way they can kill people, but trained like Navy Seals? No way. Shit the underwear dumbass picked the flight to Detroit because it was cheapest.

Honestly what has come out of this idiots? Just pissing more people off waiting in line at airports, being able to see some folks naked in a 3d scanner is all. Nothing much else, and we can see how well the 3d scanner thing has gone over...

Every idiot who does anything with a bomb I don't think should automatically be labeled as Al Quaeda, because it prob ain't so imo...but the media does like to sensationalize things like they always have. Lame.

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=chunky;954599]This story broke originally on The Boston Times on the day of the event. What I find strange is it was not mentioned on one single news channel in the UK. The only way he could justify his claims would be to get some footage from the Airport in Amsterdam, however the US government have made no statement about his claim. However you have made the mistake RM has, he's saying its the CIA you're saying its Al Qaeda and there is very little evidence to suggest either.[/quote]

thats the thing m8 there is very little evidence to back up but i know from when i used to go into looking @ conspiracy theories i came across some stuff about how the military train some people do, one of those thing was to train people to imitate other people in both voice/accent imitation and also behavioural techniques...this shit is old school and i,m sure many people around the world now do this within certain places... my point was being that no 1 really knows just how far reaching al qaeda operatives are within certain military circles around the world and based on this i drew a conclusion that its possible that they have operatives within the services that do/train in this sort of techniques, one thing that kind of backs up my claim is soldiers being randomly shot in training camps in afghanistan by a so called "buddy"

[quote]Personally I don't think this bomb was ever intended it go off. Both the pants bomber and the shoe bomber's devices failed to detonate. Both these men where suffering from degrees of mental illness. I think they where both manipulated into doing the acts they attempted. The devices failed to detonate you tell us "al qaeda extremely cunning and particularly snide, well funded and with exceptionally clever guys" but on 2 attempts they could not make an explosive that could detonate. For this to be true they are at best incompetent and maybe don't give a shit. So who benefited from the acts? I think all these 2 act did was sustain fear amongst the general public. [/quote] one thing that makes me argue against this is the fact that the shoe bomber was holding a lighter to a "potentially" explosive material, this makes me think he actually did intend to blow up the plane... the thing about the bomb material is hard to explain but hear me out here, in the 90's governments put sanctions on a chemical that was vital to the production of MDMA so makers of the drug had to synthesis a new way of making it, u cant really go into ur local shop and say "i would like some chemicals that would when come into contact with each other they explode please" so they would of had to produce those chemicals themselves and this is why i dont think the bombs went off... the war on terror imo doesn't stop @ what u see on the news etc i think it goes further than that by governments putting sanctions on some of the chemicals used in explosives making it extremely hard for those chemicals to be purchased without the correct paperwork or authority.

[quote]I think if this was a genuine attack they would have used one of their super solders and not some bloke how had some health issues [/quote]

lol why use some of your best soldiers/planners in a simple suicide mission when these guys are extremely hard to come by ? sorry chunky but that doesn't make sense to me!

[quote]I think if there is some network of terrorists they are a best incompetent and maybe don’t give a fuck.

The Printer Cartridge along with the so called Shoe Bomber and the Pants Bomber stories are even more bizarre. You would think this underground network would be able to make a bomb that was actually able to detonate. I think the bombs where never intended to go off. The where staged just so the government could sustain this idea that terror is still out there. If there hadn’t been these so called acts of terror. I think a lot of people would be asking a lot more questions about their governments.[/quote]

already touch on that above m8 with regards to chemicals... and as for government involvement in these "attack" i,m sorry m8 but i think u already know my feelings on this one

[quote]You only have to look into the history of the leader of the so called 7/7 bomber. He was picked up by the US Government then released because he was working for MI5. On the day of the bombings he left the UK. I think he manipulated these 4 people into carry out the attack and I’m not sure if they all knew what they where doing.[/quote]

considering about what i said about the "reach" of al qaeda being in places they shouldn't be this doesn't worry u in the slightest ? i would also like to see evidence of this.

[quote]Now the terrorists have moved from Martyrdom to parcel bombing we should expect more incidents and on a bigger scale. Why send 4 ink cartridges when you can send 400? Why post them from the other side of the world when you can post them internally. Why keep targeting planes when you can target trains, buses or shopping malls a lot easier? You only have to look at the terror campaign that the IRA used in the 70’s through to the 90’s. We had car bombs used on shopping malls, mortar attacks on airports, assassinations of police, the armed forces, prison guards and politicians. But these days all we see are bungled bombing attempts.

9/11 was probably the biggest act of terrorism ever, but how did the terrorist go from something that must have took a lot of planning to the pants bomber[/QUOTE]

they only send 4 instead of 400 because of what i,ve talked on previously with the chemical thing... i believe personally that these chemicals are seriously hard to come by for the average joe and yes u,ll probably go back and argue about what i,ve said about them being in places where they are not supposed to and then probably argue about the fact that why do they not get them from there? well its kinda simple m8 even for a soldier to get those chemical from the stores in bases etc its really difficult, they don't just hand then out to anyone without a reason and going through the correct paper work and of course these stores are guarded to the highest standards all the way around the clock.

targeting planes is a favourite past time of all terrorist organisation because it has such a huge shock effect because of public opinion on how secure our airports are, it makes them look sophisticated and dangerous because they are seen to availed those measures when a mission is successful. targeting people on a ground level is seen as a cowardly act right across the world which only aids in the fight against them and they do bomb places all the time abroad and shit in this way but u have to admit buy doing this on "our" soils it only opens them up to attention from homeland security, previous unseen "links" are uncovered leading them to other sources of people involved. its about numbers m8 if there are now say 10 terrorist cells operating in the uk now and the fight continues to gain popularity then in 10 years there numbers may double that amount thus making them a greater threat.

i,m glad u brought up the IRA actually, sure they did target people at ground levels but do u not consider the war on the IRA to have been successful? where are the IRA now?

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=thebanned1;954617]thats the thing m8 there is very little evidence to back up but i know from when i used to go into looking @ conspiracy theories i came across some stuff about how the military train some people do, one of those thing was to train people to imitate other people in both voice/accent imitation and also behavioural techniques...this shit is old school and i,m sure many people around the world now do this within certain places... my point was being that no 1 really knows just how far reaching al qaeda operatives are within certain military circles around the world and based on this i drew a conclusion that its possible that they have operatives within the services that do/train in this sort of techniques, one thing that kind of backs up my claim is soldiers being randomly shot in training camps in afghanistan by a so called "buddy"

[/QUOTE]

There is very little evidence to back anything up you posted above and the so called evidence there is we are not being allowed to see. You're saying no one really knows but your indicating the you believe is some super underground network of highly trained and funded assassins but we have seen no evidence of this. You should really check out The Power of Nightmares Part 3: "The Shadows in the Cave

[video=google;2081592330319789254]http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2081592330319789254#[/video]

[QUOTE=thebanned1;954617]one thing that makes me argue against this is the fact that the shoe bomber was holding a lighter to a "potentially" explosive material, this makes me think he actually did intend to blow up the plane... the thing about the bomb material is hard to explain but hear me out here, in the 90's governments put sanctions on a chemical that was vital to the production of MDMA so makers of the drug had to synthesis a new way of making it, u cant really go into ur local shop and say "i would like some chemicals that would when come into contact with each other they explode please" so they would of had to produce those chemicals themselves and this is why i dont think the bombs went off... the war on terror imo doesn't stop @ what u see on the news etc i think it goes further than that by governments putting sanctions on some of the chemicals used in explosives making it extremely hard for those chemicals to be purchased without the correct paperwork or authority.[/QUOTE]

Yes he mite have intended to detonate the supposed explosives but I'm saying I don't think the bast would have not been sufficient to actually do more than injure a few people. So the chemicals are hard to come by but it seems this hasn't stopped the on going suicide bombers in Israel or the Middle East

[QUOTE=thebanned1;954617]lol why use some of your best soldiers/planners in a simple suicide mission when these guys are extremely hard to come by ? sorry chunky but that doesn't make sense to me![/QUOTE]

Well what exactly are these solders doing? What have they been trained for? Because I've seen nothing. We are told there are all these sleeper cells in the US but what are they doing. There hasn't been anything happened in the last ten years. If 30 of these cells rig up a car like the Washington Sniper and drove around locations taking pot shots at the public like the Washington Sniper. If you had that going on in 30 states there would be a serious amount of fear and chaos and it mite change my view. So tell me what do you think the best soldiers/planners have been doing.

[QUOTE=thebanned1;954617]already touch on that above m8 with regards to chemicals... and as for government involvement in these "attack" i,m sorry m8 but i think u already know my feelings on this one[/QUOTE]

Your feelings are one reality is something else. So they are highly funded and organised but can't come across bomb making chemicals. What about these guys

[url]http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article1725608.ece[/url]

or even

[video=youtube;VlBk_98uk_Y]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlBk_98uk_Y[/video]

[QUOTE=thebanned1;954617]considering about what i said about the "reach" of al qaeda being in places they shouldn't be this doesn't worry u in the slightest ? i would also like to see evidence of this.[/QUOTE]

Well the last ten years has been evidence of this. We had 9/11 then what looks like some random acts of terror that really look like the acts of a few manipulated individuals. The only difference I have with you over this is I think they where manipulated by people in the US/UK government, you think it was al qaeda. I would like to see evidence to back up your claim about the reach of al qaeda. I don't know if you caught the news last night but they released video footage of the al qaeda Command Headquarters (I can upload the video if you want)

[QUOTE=thebanned1;954617]they only send 4 instead of 400 because of what i,ve talked on previously with the chemical thing... i believe personally that these chemicals are seriously hard to come by for the average joe and yes u,ll probably go back and argue about what i,ve said about them being in places where they are not supposed to and then probably argue about the fact that why do they not get them from there? well its kinda simple m8 even for a soldier to get those chemical from the stores in bases etc its really difficult, they don't just hand then out to anyone without a reason and going through the correct paper work and of course these stores are guarded to the highest standards all the way around the clock.[/QUOTE]

No I'm not going to argue anything of the sort i would not expect a solder to be able to get them, but people with enough money can get them. Do you think the IRA got their explosive from solders. No they got them from governments and organisations that where sympathetic to their cause and still don't have a problem these days either.

[QUOTE=thebanned1;954617]targeting planes is a favourite past time of all terrorist organisation because it has such a huge shock effect because of public opinion on how secure our airports are, it makes them look sophisticated and dangerous because they are seen to availed those measures when a mission is successful. targeting people on a ground level is seen as a cowardly act right across the world which only aids in the fight against them and they do bomb places all the time abroad and shit in this way but u have to admit buy doing this on "our" soils it only opens them up to attention from homeland security, previous unseen "links" are uncovered leading them to other sources of people involved. its about numbers m8 if there are now say 10 terrorist cells operating in the uk now and the fight continues to gain popularity then in 10 years there numbers may double that amount thus making them a greater threat.

i,m glad u brought up the IRA actually, sure they did target people at ground levels but do u not consider the war on the IRA to have been successful? where are the IRA now?[/QUOTE]

Really! The IRA very rarely targeted planes most of their attacks where in public areas, shopping malls and city centres or just gunning down politicians or military personnel in the street.. The Real IRA even managed to purchase some explosives for some car bombs that actually detonated at the beginning of this year. Maybe they should let al qaeda know who their suppler is. So if targeting people at ground level is considered a cowardly act right across the world and doing it on our own soil opens up attention from Homeland security how do you explain the 7/7 Bombings or the Times Square (didn't detonate either) car bomb last year ?

As for the IRA most of them entered into the peace negotiations and the leaders became politicians and the hard-liners formed The Real IRA who are still managing to blow shit up

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=chunky;954639]There is very little evidence to back anything up you posted above and the so called evidence there is we are not being allowed to see. You're saying no one really knows but your indicating the you believe is some super underground network of highly trained and funded assassins but we have seen no evidence of this. You should really check out The Power of Nightmares Part 3: "The Shadows in the Cave

[video=google;2081592330319789254]http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2081592330319789254#[/video] [/quote] chunky ok think about what you have just said about there being lack of evidence and then you posted a video doc, at the end of the day m8 the people who made this doc are just like me and you even though they have probably researched it as far as they can! they have little evidence either and although they may research things a little bit more than u or i do... its obvious here that mass confusion has settled in when describing things like this because of the lack of publicized info for security reasons so its obvious to me that what little info we do have is causing different people to react in different ways...this convo u and i are having should surely testify to that lol... this is why i no longer watch video's like this because @ the end of the day its just selling a story what whatever gain the producers want. as the old saying goes...don't always believe what u see on the tv. its always a bias opinion either way

[quote]Yes he mite have intended to detonate the supposed explosives but I'm saying I don't think the bast would have not been sufficient to actually do more than injure a few people. So the chemicals are hard to come by but it seems this hasn't stopped the on going suicide bombers in Israel or the Middle East[/quote]

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Explosive_belt[/url]

do u not think there is a huge difference in size with a belt filled with c4 and a pair of underwear filled with another smaller mount of explosive material... this kind of tells u about how volatile a certain chemical can be, c4 is easy to get minors use it etc ( i may be wrong on that tbh ) but the chemicals which are used in ur so called printer cartridges and shoe bombs and also underwear bombs are much much more difficult to get a hold of, all you have to do on a plane is have a sufficient amount to blow a small hole in the [url="http://www.mercuryserver.com/forums/djdb.php?id=472"]walls[/url] of the plane and if its @ 30000 feet everyone on it is completely fucked ( remember planes are pressurised )

[quote]Well what exactly are these solders doing? What have they been trained for? Because I've seen nothing. We are told there are all these sleeper cells in the US but what are they doing. There hasn't been anything happened in the last ten years. If 30 of these cells rig up a car like the Washington Sniper and drove around locations taking pot shots at the public like the Washington Sniper. If you had that going on in 30 states there would be a serious amount of fear and chaos and it mite change my view. So tell me what do you think the best soldiers/planners have been doing. [/quote]

they are passing skills to others who join the group, you cant exactly have a group of completely untrained terrorists causing havoc across the world can u ? planning ? infiltrating ?

pot shots @ people LOL come on man that's crazy, what kill ten people max before ur caught? hardly going to make a name for urself by doing amateur shit like this on the world stage are u and of course doing shit like this is going to draw lots and lots of members to joining up for the cause.

[quote]Your feelings are one reality is something else. So they are highly funded and organised but can't come across bomb making chemicals. What about these guys

[url]http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article1725608.ece[/url]

or even

[video=youtube;VlBk_98uk_Y]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlBk_98uk_Y[/video][/quote]

so u,ve never really actually seen the "sanction" in action with regards to buying lots of fertiliser in this country in action ? in fact watching the video shows you what happens when u go to buy it, like i said earlier a million times these guys are skilled, fake name ? fake id ? the guys that supply these chemicals are supposed to alert people when they try to get a lot of the stuff.

now m8 find info on how to make this fertiliser into a bomb ? its the fact that the people who carried out the 7/7 attacks were actually given that info in the first place that makes them dangerous ? its pretty difficult to find and i don't even need to try it out but this wee guy was probably caught by flagging security services watching the places where this info is kept...i do agree with you on this one though things need to be seriously tightened up when it comes to the purchasing of such chemicals.

but in all honesty do you think they would risk trying to make a bomb out of this material and take it on a plane ? probably not...the london bombings should show you how much of this shit is needed to cause damage, they were all carrying large rucksacks.

[quote]Well the last ten years has been evidence of this. We had 9/11 then what looks like some random acts of terror that really look like the acts of a few manipulated individuals. The only difference I have with you over this is I think they where manipulated by people in the US/UK government, you think it was al qaeda. I would like to see evidence to back up your claim about the reach of al qaeda. I don't know if you caught the news last night but they released video footage of the al qaeda Command Headquarters (I can upload the video if you want)[/quote]

missed the news so not seen it but doesn't the fact that they actually have a command headquarters place not alert you to the fact that these guys are somewhat organised ? chunky i would also like to see hard evidence of the reach of al qaeda but your never really going to see it in your lifetime, doesn't the fact that intelligence agencies from all around the world watching these guys alert you to how dangerous they are ?

do you think that all this information on these guys is fabricated ? if so then then why is there so much intelligence gathering of these guys on a world wide stage and don't you think if other intelligence services looked into these guys and found nothing for themselves they would continue looking @ them ? you completely overlooking the fact that this is not just US/UK security services looking into these guys. its just the UK/US services that seem to be taking all the shit for it, what about bombings in spain etc ? do u not think the spanish have an interest in these people too ?

no offence m8 but i can hardly see the US and UK services manipulating people to bomb places like spain when there are huge business ties to consider...doesn't make sense m8, honestly.

[quote]No I'm not going to argue anything of the sort i would not expect a solder to be able to get them, but people with enough money can get them. Do you think the IRA got their explosive from solders. No they got them from governments and organisations that where sympathetic to their cause and still don't have a problem these days either.[/quote]

the IRA got most of there arms and explosives from Libya apparently so yes your correct on that front but look what happened to libya when the were thought to have ties to terrorists especially after the lockerbie bombing, sanctions were put in place and they were completely cut off from most business ties in the western world. i dont know about u but if i were high up in the government in a country and i had seen what happened to the people in countries like libya and north korea with sanctions in place would u really want to put ur people through that to help "terrorists" in todays world ? fuck in north korea they use human excrement as fertiliser :what

while were on this subject i have a question for you...what do u consider irans stance on al qaeda to be ?

sympathetic ?

i have views on this and i,ll only say one thing, yes i do believe that if iran were to reach full nuclear capability they would sell some of the shit to al qaeda if it were bought with the intention on hitting the US

[quote]Really! The IRA very rarely targeted planes most of their attacks where in public areas, shopping malls and city centres or just gunning down politicians or military personnel in the street.. The Real IRA even managed to purchase some explosives for some car bombs that actually detonated at the beginning of this year. Maybe they should let al qaeda know who their suppler is. So if targeting people at ground level is considered a cowardly act right across the world and doing it on our own soil opens up attention from Homeland security how do you explain the 7/7 Bombings or the Times Square (didn't detonate either) car bomb last year ?

As for the IRA most of them entered into the peace negotiations and the leaders became politicians and the hard-liners formed The Real IRA who are still managing to blow shit up[/QUOTE]

the IRA were man enough to give bomb warnings when the bombs were in place on the UK mainland, they only really wanted to target UK government and army, completely different story in ireland though...kill anything that moves especially in northern ireland. the IRA knew they were fucked when the americans got involved because they knew that if they didn't stop they would now be facing the same situation as al qaeda are in now... i don't really think u can compare the IRA and al qaeda as the same type of threat, i didnt hear of any IRA bombings in a foreign country other than the UK did u ? oh and the favoured explosive of the IRA is semtex and considering as far as explosives go thats pretty easy to get.

7/7 well it wasn't exactly another 9/11 was it ? ask yourself why ? u,ll never see the likes of another 9/11 in your lifetime because after it happened lessons were learned...fuck these guys would be carrying out 9/11's on a daily basis if they could get away with it... do u not think that by looking into the people who done the mi5 haven't gained knowledge of other radicals since then? just because the guy has radical views doesn't mean that u can pull him in and put him in jail...they have to catch them in the act first.

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

p.s. sorry for the late reply man, i was on skype

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

taking the chemical thing further and also the knowledge thing further.. sleeper cells as they are so called are given info on how to carry out a mission, that mission will also include not only plans of how to carry out the mission but also the knowledge of how to manufacture the tools which are used in the mission... these are things like how to turn fertiliser into a bomb how to manufacture and mix chemicals to make them volatile etc etc....

i,m drawing my own conclusions here that most of the guys are only following probably highly detailed instructions and are not exactly fully trained on how to mix chemicals properly like a trained chemist would, in my eyes this is why both the shoe bomber and the pants bomber failed their missions failed in blowing those planes out the sky because they didn't correctly fuse the chemicals in the right way, this would also explain other failed attacks...

i guess the next step for al qaeda is to train people in chemical fusion and send them on a martyrdom missions all over the place, these things take time so in one way this would explain why you are seeing a lack of "attacks".. they are capable of this...this is a huge danger for everyone involved and imo its a good thing that the nip in the butt attitude is being shown as things stand just now, like i have said previously you never really know who someone is by walking past them in the street unless they advertise it, still think sleeper cells are not dangerous ?.

you will never really truly understand paranoia until you have experienced it to a degree yourself.

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE]don't always believe what u see on the tv. its always a bias opinion either way[/QUOTE]

You don't live what you preach.

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=thebanned1;954683]chunky ok think about what you have just said about there being lack of evidence and then you posted a video doc, at the end of the day m8 the people who made this doc are just like me and you even though they have probably researched it as far as they can! they have little evidence either and although they may research things a little bit more than u or i do... its obvious here that mass confusion has settled in when describing things like this because of the lack of publicized info for security reasons so its obvious to me that what little info we do have is causing different people to react in different ways...this convo u and i are having should surely testify to that lol... this is why i no longer watch video's like this because @ the end of the day its just selling a story what whatever gain the producers want. as the old saying goes...don't always believe what u see on the tv. its always a bias opinion either way.[/QUOTE]

The video was made by the BBC and much of the footage was done by reporters who spent time with Bin Laden. Also you have made the same misstake as Running Man again. You have appliy the same argrument you are using to justsify your opinon and saying I can not use the same.

I will be back on this when I get home. I'm not allowed to post much at work

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=Shpira;954714]You don't live what you preach.[/QUOTE]

i dont watch tv now for the exact same reasons as i previously stated, if there is a story that interests me i,ll read up on it, its easier to spot inconsistencies in a story and u learn from that what they do know and what they are fabricating because if u watch say the 6 oclock news each day then that means they tell u a story and 24 hours later they can tell u another thing and u,ll have forgot the minute details of the story u were told yesterday. just after bin ladens death i went to a bbc website and there was a story on it ( sorry no longer have the link ) but it had several tabs with different stories on the same page, i began to read the first page and when i had read that i clicked the tab to goto the next page and they were telling me one thing on the first page and telling me the exact opposite on the next page, clicked the next tab and read the next page and again they were telling me a different story yet again about the same thing.

at the end of the day m8 whats to stop u from getting a job as a reporter if u have the qualifications ? nothing !!! each on of us are equal and were only human, same with politicians at the end of the day they are only human, they will be given information and told "look u cant tell the public this" so they will say ok i,ve been briefed and when asked about it they will tell u a story about it as much as they can, 24 hours later and they have had more information put into their head thus distracting them from what they said previously and someone asks them another question, they forget what they said initially and said something different..

imo this is how many conspiracy theories are born because people analyse what info is shown to them by who ever and inconsistencies in the story are found thus making the people that are telling the stories look like liars, just because a politician has told u a little fib doesn't mean to say he's an outright liar.. i,m sure if they could tell u in great detail the info they have on events like 9/11 they would but they cant for obvious reasons...to give another example of what i mean... i,ve been talking in this thread now for a good what ? 15 pages ? i cant even remember what i said 5 pages ago and i,m sure i,ve probably contradicted myself @ some point...

u think my opinion is bias ? i don't, i,m open to idea's but i will tell u right now i,ll look into things in a different way from most of u!

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=chunky;954766]The video was made by the BBC and much of the footage was done by reporters who spent time with Bin Laden. Also you have made the same misstake as Running Man again. You have appliy the same argrument you are using to justsify your opinon and saying I can not use the same.

I will be back on this when I get home. I'm not allowed to post much at work[/QUOTE]

just because its on the BBC doesn't mean to say its a correct opinion on the matter m8 and yes they may have spent time with bin laden in the making of the video but i,m sure u might look favourably on someone who has show u good hospitality

i dont understand what u are meaning when u are saying i made the same mistake... were not arguing here!! were basically as someone said to me last night "throwing idea's around" and yes there is a difference in opinion.

p.s. i,m gonna watch the vid

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

LOL @ this whole thread... [IMG]http://images.cheezburger.com/completestore/2010/11/17/5a0f1fbe-79ab-44d0-9bfc-85848cf02751.jpg[/IMG]

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=Shpira;954787]LOL @ this whole thread... [IMG]http://images.cheezburger.com/completestore/2010/11/17/5a0f1fbe-79ab-44d0-9bfc-85848cf02751.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]

Stop trolling

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

ok watched it, knew what it was going to be like from just watching the first 2 minutes

ok a couple of things that stood out to be was the mention on a dirty bomb, ok in itself it might not be a potentially lethal attack in itself but i don't think you are seeing what's potential in the future and i think blair hit the nail in the head...its clear to me that if al qaeda are getting potentially access to nuclear material now then what is the potential of them getting something a little stronger more deadly in another 10-15-20 years of radicalism? i don't know how many times i,ve heard the government talk about protecting our childrens future and i think this is a prime example of what they are talking about.

al qaeda don't exist its all in the imagination of politicians well they kinda fucked themselves up a bit in their own video buy saying that "al qaeda was just an idea in the mind of young radical muslims ".. just thinking of that send shivers down my spine, the idea is there and its potentially a dangerous one no matter if anything has been acted upon it or not... i believe its there and its dangerous!!!

the video of disney land and the sketch drawing that was found under the couch...if it was what the FBI believed it was then the people that made both are hardly going to put stickers on both labelling them saying " highly classified information - al qaeda plans " .. i think this was justified action by the FBI as terrorists are not exactly known to not have done this in the past, the IRA for one used tourists videos of london to plan attacks.

what about the guys that were known to have been in afghanistan ? i don't quite understand this bit tbh, i mean if i were to go to ireland and hang about with the real IRA for a while and they trained me in whatever wouldn't you consider me to be dangerous ? i mean if i really wanted to do that and did it ask yourself both why i did it and secondly why i moved to a foreign country where these people were seen to be the enemy ? this takes me back to a couple of things i said, were all humans and we make mistakes and also u,ll never really truly understand paranoia until you have experienced it yourself.

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE=Shpira;954787]LOL @ this whole thread... [IMG]http://images.cheezburger.com/completestore/2010/11/17/5a0f1fbe-79ab-44d0-9bfc-85848cf02751.jpg[/IMG][/QUOTE]

Shpira... this is an exact example of why the politics forum was closed, if you don't have something constructive or objective to say them why are you posting in the thread ? because it seems to me like your just trying to wind people up!!!

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE]do u not think there is a huge difference in size with a belt filled with c4 and a pair of underwear filled with another smaller mount of explosive material... this kind of tells u about how volatile a certain chemical can be, c4 is easy to get minors use it etc ( i may be wrong on that tbh ) but the chemicals which are used in ur so called printer cartridges and shoe bombs and also underwear bombs are much much more difficult to get a hold of, all you have to do on a plane is have a sufficient amount to blow a small hole in the [URL="http://www.mercuryserver.com/forums/djdb.php?id=472"]walls[/URL] of the plane and if its @ 30000 feet everyone on it is completely fucked ( remember planes are pressurised )[/QUOTE]

So because he has a smaller amount in his pants you are lead to believe that it must be somehow more volatile. But you have no evidence of this? I'm saying I reckon they had just the right amount to cause an effect and nothing more. Funny you bring up the printer cartridges, they never went off either. Just enough to cause a stir. Is this really the MO of a highly trained and funded terrorist organisation. If it is I for one am not impressed. I fact I've seen better performance at work from people who spend half their day in the toilet and the other half exchanging extreme porn and happy slapping videos on their mobile phone.

Re: Bin Laden's Pictures to be released.

[QUOTE]they are passing skills to others who join the group, you cant exactly have a group of completely untrained terrorists causing havoc across the world can u ? planning ? infiltrating ? [/QUOTE]

Haven't you contradicted yourself here? one minute your telling us they are trained they you state that you can't have untrained terrorist causing havoc. So you reckon they are just passing the skills on down a long line of people in case one day one of them decides to actually do something. Have you any evidence to support your claim that they have infiltrated somewhere. They have had 15 year to get there shit together, how long does it take.