Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=Localizer;853962]Do yourself a favor and go hang out with your kid. It seems like you spend more time being a conspiracy theorist, and less time being a father.[/QUOTE]

[FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2]All you are tiring to do here is find weakness in runningman from observations you can exploit in things he has posted about himself. You are just tiring to cause upset by using his unborn child as some sort of insult on a personal level to get a reaction. All you are really doing is tiring to divert away from the subject matter and revert to cheep insults. If I had told you I was gay you would have reverted to calling me a cheep fag by now because you have to result to insults to state your case.[/SIZE][/FONT]

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=chunky;854042]

[SIZE=2]But Localizer you commit the same crime you are accusing me of. You to are hiding behind your computer posting pretending you know me. You have also justified what I posted in my other post by calling me a coward. Yes these soldiers are in difficult situations but that doesn’t excuse this sort of behavior. If this had happened in the US you would all be singing to a different tune? I suppose this event was a more extreme version of the Rodney King incident. [/SIZE] [/quote] No, I never implied, or insinuated, any sort of claim that I know who you are or what you do. I blatantly stated that you have no idea what is going on over there so you are not in any place to judge any other soldier except those involved. That was made very clear. Furthermore, I never stated that their behavior should be excused. If you read my paragraph again, it most succinctly states that because you have no idea what is going on over there, you can only criticize the soldiers involved in this incident. In other words, stop paint-brushing the military. It's unfortunate that I had to make a redundant reply to your comments.

[quote] [SIZE=2]Had my message been posted without me butchering the English language would it of justified my views in your opinion? I think not! You mite want to check your own spelling as well. I don’t think I have posted anything either indicating that I am shit scared of shadow governments. So I would be grateful if you could point me in the direction of where I did. You mite also want to note that I stood and spoke out at work when 4000 other people wouldn’t when my employer tried to make us work in conditions that where completely unacceptable, alienating about 1500 people I work with and see every day. I also helped expose another employer on national TV for violence in the work place. So you don’t need to worry about me hiding behind my PC[/SIZE] [/quote]

No, you fail to understand the concept of using grammar and spelling appropriately. It's meant to convey your message so that others can understand what you are saying without confusion. In being able to coherently put sentences together, you would be taken more seriously while still maintaining justification of your opinions. You don't have to be perfect at it, but learning the difference between 'mite' and 'might' would be a significant start since both words mean two different things.

But to get back on point, your unadulterated reviews of 9/11 with RM are more than enough to show that you embrace the notion of shadow governments, and hence are worried about them. And your examples of you taking a proactive approach in the workplace relate to generalizing soldiers how? It has no relevance to you lambasting people who are fighting around the world. If you had said 'I was in Afghanistan, so I know what it's like,' then maybe, just maybe, your opinion and your comments would hold some weight.

[quote] [SIZE=2]This whole coward insinuation/comment is actually quite amusing it’s become the typical knee jerk reaction against anyone who questions the military. No different than people who brand people who question 9/11 as holocaust deniers [/SIZE][/QUOTE]

It's one thing to question the military; it's another thing to just verbally attack all soldiers of the armed forces.

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=runningman;854074]Local the suicide rate of veterans proves that you are wrong that these things don't happen all the time. Your vets come home and kill themselves because they can't handle that they sold their soul. They can't believe what they have done. The MSM make it sound like they have some illness coming home from war. I don't think it is responsible to just look the other way on the facts, and the facts are that the veteran suicide rate is unacceptable. [/quote]

What the hell are you talking about? Do you know why a soldier gets PTSD? No, you don't. All you know is that they were in another country during wartime. Somehow you're trying to correlate killing innocent civilians with all suicides by vets.

[quote] Also I can sit behind my computer and do what I can to help the troops. And by help I mean get them get home.
[/quote] Right, I'm sure you do.

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=chunky;854099][FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2]All you are tiring to do here is find weakness in runningman from observations you can exploit in things he has posted about himself. You are just tiring to cause upset by using his unborn child as some sort of insult on a personal level to get a reaction. All you are really doing is tiring to divert away from the subject matter and revert to cheep insults. If I had told you I was gay you would have reverted to calling me a cheep fag by now because you have to result to insults to state your case.[/SIZE][/FONT][/QUOTE]

Please spare me the charades and the bullshit. The people who have seen me debate or post here know the content of my posts and far be it for you to say that I would take my frustration and manifest it into something as crude as calling people 'fags.' My mistake was assuming he already had his child and was spending more time on the boards than with his kid. It's called 'criticism.'

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=Localizer;854203]

No, you fail to understand the concept of using grammar and spelling appropriately. It's meant to convey your message so that others can understand what you are saying without confusion. In being able to coherently put sentences together, you would be taken more seriously while still maintaining justification of your opinions. You don't have to be perfect at it, but learning the difference between 'mite' and 'might' would be a significant start since both words mean two different things.

[/QUOTE] I so hate people using grammar/ spelling as a weapon, especially in emotive issues like this! The one thing that shines brightly from Chunky's post is that he feels very deeply for all the people involved here , both the soldiers and the victims.

How about you quit the bullshit? It's patently obvious that you find the weakness and go for the throat in a very personal way. And you are very good at that , but that is definitely not an attribute any good debater would claim .

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=DIDI;854227]I so hate people using grammar/ spelling as a weapon, especially in emotive issues like this! The one thing that shines brightly from Chunky's post is that he feels very deeply for all the people involved here , both the soldiers and the victims. [/QUOTE]

I so hate people who are kiss-asses. In any case, there are many here who feel for the victims/soldiers. Where do you come off suggesting that those of us who disagree with him are somehow not empathetic to those involved?

[quote] How about you quit the bullshit? It's patently obvious that you find the weakness and go for the throat in a very personal way. And you are very good at that , but that is definitely not an attribute any good debater would claim .[/quote]Is it now? Tell me another time I've 'gone for the throat?' Please, I'm very interested in your accusation. But you won't find that will you?...because it's never happened before on here.

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

Look I can assure you that Didi wouldn't come to save me.. We have had it out and if there is one thing I know Didi will call it out.

Now back to the issue. PTSD.. Post [U]Tramatic Stress[/U] Disorder. [I]PTSD is caused by a psychologically traumatic event involving actual or threatened death or serious injury to oneself or others. Such triggering events are called 'stressors'; they may be experienced alone or while in a large group. Violent personal assault, such as rape or mugging, car or plane accidents, military combat, industrial accidents and natural disasters, such as earthquakes and hurricanes, are stressors which have caused people to suffer from PTSD.

[/I][I][B]Do I believe that US soldiers are stressed out because their life has been in danger?? Absolutely. But I do also believe that a lot of your soldiers are coming home because they are stressed because of the harm they have inflicted on others. They can't live with the occupation.. And they shouldn't have to. War is one thing.. Occupation is another. This is what occupation does, it wears the troops moral down and they start making frustrated and foolish mistakes. But unfortunetly these mistakes cost lives. Then they come home and can't cope. I mean 1 million Iraqis have died since the troops have been there to "liberate" them.
[/B]

^^ Sorry I had to put in bold because I couldn't get the Italic to turn off.. I'm not yelling or stressing the point.

[/I]

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=Localizer;854232]I so hate people who are kiss-asses. In any case, there are many here who feel for the victims/soldiers. Where do you come off suggesting that those of us who disagree with him are somehow not empathetic to those involved?

Is it now? Tell me another time I've 'gone for the throat?' Please, I'm very interested in your accusation. But you won't find that will you?...because it's never happened before on here.[/QUOTE] It that kiss arse comment was at me you may find yourself outvoted here :lol: I have disagreed with an awful lot people here at some time or another. :lol: I wasn't suggesting others were lacking in empathy, just you .

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=Localizer;854203]No, I never implied, or insinuated, any sort of claim that I know who you are or what you do. I blatantly stated that you have no idea what is going on over there so you are not in any place to judge any other soldier except those involved. That was made very clear. Furthermore, I never stated that their behavior should be excused. If you read my paragraph again, it most succinctly states that because you have no idea what is going on over there, you can only criticize the soldiers involved in this incident. In other words, stop paint-brushing the military. It's unfortunate that I had to make a redundant reply to your comments.

No, you fail to understand the concept of using grammar and spelling appropriately. It's meant to convey your message so that others can understand what you are saying without confusion. In being able to coherently put sentences together, you would be taken more seriously while still maintaining justification of your opinions. You don't have to be perfect at it, but learning the difference between 'mite' and 'might' would be a significant start since both words mean two different things.

But to get back on point, your unadulterated reviews of 9/11 with RM are more than enough to show that you embrace the notion of shadow governments, and hence are worried about them. And your examples of you taking a proactive approach in the workplace relate to generalizing soldiers how? It has no relevance to you lambasting people who are fighting around the world. If you had said 'I was in Afghanistan, so I know what it's like,' then maybe, just maybe, your opinion and your comments would hold some weight.

It's one thing to question the military; it's another thing to just verbally attack all soldiers of the armed forces.[/QUOTE]

So what you are saying is that unless you are in the military you have no right to scrutinize??? That's easily by far the stupidest logic posted yet. Should we all just revert to a military dictatorship because we don't know what they have been through...boo hoo fucking hoo. They volunteered for that shit no one made them go. To label someone a coward because they don't want to fight in your fucking retarded war for profits and oil is plain wrong. The US has not fought a "just" war since WW2 and even then your corporations traded with the Nazi's. Seriously these kind of posts make want to throw up...poor US soldiers...supplied with state of the art equipment invading a country that never did anything to them which has an unorganized army equipped with weapons made 30 years ago...boo hoo hoo...my heart is really bleeding for them.

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=runningman;854262]

[/I][I][B]Do I believe that US soldiers are stressed out because their life has been in danger?? Absolutely. But I do also believe that a lot of your soldiers are coming home because they are stressed because of the harm they have inflicted on others. They can't live with the occupation.. And they shouldn't have to. War is one thing.. Occupation is another. This is what occupation does, it wears the troops moral down and they start making frustrated and foolish mistakes. But unfortunetly these mistakes cost lives. Then they come home and can't cope. I mean 1 million Iraqis have died since the troops have been there to "liberate" them.
[/B]

[/I][/QUOTE]

Again, you're drawing conclusions from thin air. You're assuming you know why someone has PTSD, and that is based on the idea that they know they 'occupy' a country. Is it one facet of PTSD? possibly. Is it a significant part of why they have PTSD? nobody knows other than the docs doing psych evals on them. Essentially, you do not have the insight to make any of those claims you just made. You're merely using conjecture to go from point A to point B.

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=DIDI;854270]It that kiss arse comment was at me you may find yourself outvoted here :lol: I have disagreed with an awful lot people here at some time or another. :lol: I wasn't suggesting others were lacking in empathy, just you .[/QUOTE]

Disagreeing with someone does not negate you from kissing ass. In any case, you're right, I'm just the big bad un-empathetic 'Merican.

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=Shpira;854318]So what you are saying is that unless you are in the military you have no right to scrutinize??? That's easily by far the stupidest logic posted yet. Should we all just revert to a military dictatorship because we don't know what they have been through...boo hoo fucking hoo. They volunteered for that shit no one made them go. To label someone a coward because they don't want to fight in your fucking retarded war for profits and oil is plain wrong. The US has not fought a "just" war since WW2 and even then your corporations traded with the Nazi's. Seriously these kind of posts make want to throw up...poor US soldiers...supplied with state of the art equipment invading a country that never did anything to them which has an unorganized army equipped with weapons made 30 years ago...boo hoo hoo...my heart is really bleeding for them.[/QUOTE]

You should use your expensive 'Londres' education and reread what it said at the bottom.

[quote]It's one thing to question the military; it's another thing to just verbally attack all soldiers of the armed forces. [/quote]

Do I care if you criticize the military? no. Do I care when you start calling them killers and words/phrases of the like? yes.

The coward is the one that talks shit to them but won't stand in their shoes. Yes they signed up voluntarily, but if no one signed up, who would? And who would be part of the armed forces? You certainly wouldn't. But I suppose you'd rather have a draft when the government saw fit for any war?

Lots of people go in thinking they might do the right thing or they might fight for the right causes. Do I agree with the war? Hell no, and I'm more inclined to think Afghani occupation is for the sake of opium and to set up shop closer to Russia and her allies. But I'm not about to talk shit to people that can't exactly go back on their orders. Some soldiers feel the war is justified, others feel it isn't. Some Iraqis/Afghanis have gained something from this, and others have lost from it.

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[SIZE=2][QUOTE=Localizer;854203]No, I never implied, or insinuated, any sort of claim that I know who you are or what you do. .[/QUOTE][/SIZE] [SIZE=2]You called me a coward I would say that is an indication that you somehow think you know me.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=2][QUOTE=Localizer;854203] It's one thing to question the military; it's another thing to just verbally attack all soldiers of the armed forces.[/QUOTE][/SIZE]

[SIZE=2]Care to point out where I actually did this?[/SIZE]

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=Localizer;854207]Please spare me the charades and the bullshit. The people who have seen me debate or post here know the content of my posts and far be it for you to say that I would take my frustration and manifest it into something as crude as calling people 'fags.' My mistake was assuming he already had his child and was spending more time on the boards than with his kid. It's called 'criticism.'[/QUOTE]

So is refuring to people as a piss ants wasnt a sign of frustration :lol:

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=Localizer;[SIZE=2]854392[/SIZE]] [SIZE=2]The coward is the one that talks shit to them but won't stand in their shoes. Yes they signed up voluntarily, but if no one signed up, who would? And who would be part of the armed forces? You certainly wouldn't. But I suppose you'd rather have a draft when the government saw fit for any war? [/SIZE]

[SIZE=2][/QUOTE][/SIZE]

[SIZE=2]The draft mite not be a bad idea. More than half of the UK citizens where against the war. I would like to see the British Government draft its citizens with such opposition.[/SIZE]

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[QUOTE=Kamal;853593]I dont know if this political debate or rm's playground of "thank you's"[/QUOTE]

The whole thank you posts are just an excuse for mutual back slapping in the politics forum. It looks more like people are actually siding with people rather than thanking them for something.

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I was just mocking the thanks system..

But I kind of like it now.. I like watching who sides with who. To see if alliances ever break. Somehow someway I will get Florida and Toasty to disagree.

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

i have exams tomorrow, i'll post more later this week

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=runningman;854486]I was just mocking the thanks system..

But I kind of like it now.. I like watching who sides with who. .[/QUOTE]

Trollish [IMG]http://www.widereach.net/emoticons/troll.gif[/IMG]

[IMG]http://www.funnyforumpics.com/forums/GTFO/3/gto_gtfo.jpg[/IMG]

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=chunky;854470][/SIZE]

[SIZE=2]The draft mite not be a bad idea. More than half of the UK citizens where against the war. I would like to see the British Government draft its citizens with such opposition.[/SIZE][/QUOTE]

That's exactly my point. He asks "who would fight?" that is the whole point! In case any of you haven't realized - I AM AGAINST THIS WAR.

[QUOTE=Localizer;854392]You should use your expensive 'Londres' education and reread what it said at the bottom.

Do I care if you criticize the military? no. Do I care when you start calling them killers and words/phrases of the like? yes.

The coward is the one that talks shit to them but won't stand in their shoes. Yes they signed up voluntarily, but if no one signed up, who would? And who would be part of the armed forces? You certainly wouldn't. But I suppose you'd rather have a draft when the government saw fit for any war?

Lots of people go in thinking they might do the right thing or they might fight for the right causes. Do I agree with the war? Hell no, and I'm more inclined to think Afghani occupation is for the sake of opium and to set up shop closer to Russia and her allies. But I'm not about to talk shit to people that can't exactly go back on their orders. Some soldiers feel the war is justified, others feel it isn't. Some Iraqis/Afghanis have gained something from this, and others have lost from it.[/QUOTE]

My "expensive Londres education"...lol are you on crack dude? It must be wonderful to think that some should be ashamed of their education. Ideas and arguments are equally valid regardless of where they come from. I didn't challenge your background but your ideas. Anyway, I think that comment speaks for your frame of mind quite nicely. I don't presume to know the right cause to kill another man...i don't think that anyone has the right to decide to go to war with a different nation and the only justifiable war is a war of self defense. Afghanistan can be argued but there is no argument over Iraq to be made.

p.s. I call it what as I see it. The way the US Army behaves in Iraq deserves no praise but I guess my memory spans a bit further than that of a gold fish.

p.p.s good luck in your exam

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

Looks like the soldiers are playing a game of co-op Modern Warfare 2 and showing equal regard for the targets they hit.

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

Fark those gunners.

There, I said it.

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

^so what? spend a day or a week even with the guys in that video, and at the end of your time together, I'd be willing to bet just about anything you wouldn't be saying "F*ck you" to any of them.

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

i wouldn't say fuck you but i would say fuck your dumb. not only that, you got our men down there after spraying the area with bullets filled with depleted uranium. dumb asses!

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actually everyone above would be saying "thank you for saving my fucking life when we got shot at and i crawled up into a little ball and started whimpering" i love how everyone on here takes a 30 minute video from a warzone and thinks they know whats up with everyone involved.

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lol, I'd love to know the blood pressure of the people posting in this thread as opposed to the boobie thread

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=res0nat0r;855141]actually everyone above would be saying "thank you for saving my fucking life when we got shot at and i crawled up into a little ball and started whimpering" i love how everyone on here takes a 30 minute video from a warzone and thinks they know whats up with everyone involved.[/QUOTE]

[FONT=Verdana]Back to the coward routine again. I love the way you draw stupid conclusions about people you don't know and copy & paste most of your conclusions from Wikipedia. The soldier in that video is no different than Eric Harris or Dylan Klebold and the people who witnessed this and did nothing are not a great deal better[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2][/SIZE][/FONT]

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

thanks for reiterating my above post.

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

The bottom line is that they weren't engaged with the enemy. They killed innocent people. They didn't even feel remorse when they were told the children were hit.

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But you know how reso feels about the army and guns! my country right or wrong and everyone who dissagrees is a pussy.

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[ATTACH=CONFIG]4674[/ATTACH]

"You better like killing kids.... OOHHH YAAAA!!...."

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[QUOTE=runningman;855169]The bottom line is that they weren't engaged with the enemy.[/QUOTE] Sure about that?

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

I didn't see anybody shooting at them. I saw a bunch of guys walking the streets get hosed down by an Apahe.. Then I saw then hose down an ambulance with children in it.

Why what did you see? Or should I say what did the gov't tell you what you saw?

[ATTACH=CONFIG]4676[/ATTACH]

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

Wait I thought there was a supposedly a guy who looked like he had a gun and also that chopper took fire earlier in that area. I guess they should have waited for a guy with what looks like a gun to shoot at them to make sure it was a real gun, so just in case a small video snippet ever was seen on the internet it would appease the peanut gallery.

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

I didn't see that on the video. show me the video where the shooting took place. And yes you should be sure that the guy has a gun. That is the problem with occupation. This isn't a war. Thank you for confirming it.

Engage: to bring (troops) into conflict; enter into conflict with: Our army engaged the enemy.

Where was the enemy in the video? Where was Al Qaeda. Do you think those dozen guys have families. Do you think they will want revenge. Do yo uactually believe this is helping the "War on Terror?"

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=res0nat0r;855201]Wait I thought there was a supposedly a guy who looked like he had a gun and also that chopper took fire earlier in that area. I guess they should have waited for a guy with what looks like a gun to shoot at them to make sure it was a real gun, so just in case a small video snippet ever was seen on the internet it would appease the peanut gallery.[/QUOTE]

[FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2]Is that what you do in the US if you think someone is carrying a gun shoot them in the back? I imagine quite a few people in Afghanistan & Iraq carry guns. [/SIZE][/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2][/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2]Was there any purpose in the chopper being there anyway? It certainly didn’t help anyone. Maybe the soldiers would be less stressed had they not spent the day flying around for no purpose. The actions of the helicopter crew remind me of the soldiers in Abu Ghraib who justified their actions by torturing prisoners because they had had some mortars fired over the prison wall earlier in the day. [/SIZE][/FONT]

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:roflmao: you guys really are somethin let me tell ya. will ashton kutcher please stand up because we are really getting punk'd.

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[FONT=Verdana]Just out of interest how many of you coward callers here are actually in the military? You buy into this whole war on terror and believe in the cause. How many have joined up since 9/11? You insinuate critics are cowards because they won’t risk losing their lives in a war they don’t believe in. I recon Loco maybe, but more likely he has relatives in the military, but then I’m from a military family (and yes they are currently serving in Afghanistan) so that’s not worth much. So how many people here are actually proactive? [/FONT]

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they were "flying around for no purpose" huh? Interesting.

Re: Video-US Apache helicopter killing civilians and journalists

[QUOTE=res0nat0r;855225]:they were "flying around for no purpose" huh? Interesting.[/QUOTE]

What purpose where they serving. They didnt benifit anyone.