[B]GAZA CITY[/B] (CNN) -- The United Nations and the European Union have condemned an Israeli tank attack on the northern Gaza city of Beit Hanoun that Palestinian medical sources said killed 18 people.

EU's external relations chief Benita Ferrero-Waldner described the attack on Wednesday morning as a "profoundly shocking event."

Among those killed by the 10 artillery rounds was a 13-member family that included seven children, the sources said.

The offensive resumed just hours after the Israel Defense Forces announced their withdrawal from Beit Hanoun Tuesday, ending a week-long offensive aimed at rooting out militants who have been firing rockets into southern Israel.

More than 50 Palestinians, most of them militants, have been killed in the operation, according to The Associated Press.

([URL="http://edition.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/11/08/israel.gaza/index.html"]full story[/URL])

Guess they forgot to finish off a few civilians when they pulled out of the town... [/sarcasm]

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

they'll never stop

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

^and neither will the Palestinians, as well as the rest of the arabs in the region :roll: ...which is why this conflict sadly will never end. :(

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

Yup...there history of bad blood goes back to far.

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

but the democrats won the houses, and according to john kerry, they will end the hatred int he middle east.

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and they lived happy ever after ...

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... and all bred little clintons and kennedys

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lots of blowjobs and whiskey

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:CrackUp:

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

Who gives a flying fuck. Another 10, 15, or 50 means absolutly nothing.

Golda once said when the arabs start loving their children more than they hate us (or something like that) then maybe there will be peace.

Hamas and the other Palestinian scum that are more prepared to sacrifice their own in their battle against the very exsistance of my country are the ones who are to blame for the death of every single Palestinian killed by the IDF - and for those simpletons out there who finally think i've lost it, heres a simple message. Stop firing rockets from your slums into my country then our army will leave you alone. Stop firing rockets from amongst your civillian population and then your civillians wont get killed when we react to your aggression.

Lets hope that those fluffy europeans (and other wishy washey liberals) out there instead of condeming Israel for a change, condemn the real murderers of Palestinian woman and children - namely those militant groups (Hamas included) that surround themselves by, you guessed it Palesinian women and children.

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

^^^ Actually, after having read that post, I'd say you're not much different from a Hamas/Hezbollah militant Dave...

Sting - Russians

[FONT=Verdana][COLOR=White][SIZE=2] In Europe and America, there's a growing feeling of hysteria Conditioned to respond to all the threats In the rhetorical speeches of the Soviets Mr. Krushchev said we will bury you I don't subscribe to this point of view It would be such an ignorant thing to do If the Russians love their children too

How can I save my little boy from Oppenheimer's deadly toy There is no monopoly in common sense On either side of the political fence We share the same biology Regardless of ideology Believe me when I say to you I hope the Russians love their children too

There is no historical precedent To put the words in the mouth of the President There's no such thing as a winnable war It's a lie that we don't believe anymore Mr. Reagan says we will protect you I don't subscribe to this point of view Believe me when I say to you I hope the Russians love their children too

We share the same biology Regardless of ideology What might save us, me, and you Is that the Russians love their children too[/SIZE][/COLOR][/FONT]

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

[quote=KinKyJ;404589]^^^ Actually, after having read that post, I'd say you're not much different from a Hamas/Hezbollah militant Dave... [/quote]

And then you would be showing your complete and utter stupidity wouldnt you Jan.

Does the wishey washey European liberal need to be shown the differences or can you figure them out by yourself?

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

^^^^^ Man I love to see the real you ,(Who gives a flying fuck. Another 10, 15, or 50 means absolutly nothing) , and you know what (Who gives a fuck when a kamikaze blow himself in the middle of TLV then ?).I try to avoid talking to you since the last time we were debating about the crimes your country commited in Lebanon , I prefere when you directly say it like you did today , you are learning to say what you really think not try to show that you are a peacful person.

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

I love it whenm morons only pick out part of what you say.

Say BULULULULULULULULULU would you like me to repost in another language, so that you actually understand what I say?

Or maybe you would like to get your head out of that ass of yours and actually look at why the brave fighters of the IDF were actually in that scum hole in Gaza to start with; or on seconds thoughts, don't bother, you have no concept of the truth in this or any other scenario dealing with the bitter conflict between Israel and a bunch of children of Egyptian migrant workers from the end of the 19th Century.

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Fuck you mr I know everything and I am always right. plus another story of your brave fucking soldires being there because they couldn't do anything else. Fuck your Army and hope that the blood of thoes little children killed two days ago wont be wasted for nothing.

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dave .. thats the mentallity thats keeping alive the conflict ....... + i think your coments are very insulting , and that you are as ignorant as those palestinians firing rockets your way bottom line is you people only have 2 options 1) give them what they want , 2) kill them all .... neither of the 2 will happen ... so you better smart up a little bit and stop thinking that you have been victims for 2000 years and now is your time for payback

PS. you should be carefull what you write here .. music is the priority in this forum

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

I'm disappointed that this discussion has denigrated to this so quickly. :(

So let me just try and say a few things in dave's defense here since everyone is ganging up on him.

Does anyone else find anything wrong that all the blame on the Lebanon conflict has been dumped on the Israelis?

Where is the blame to the Lebanese government for allowing Hamas to settle in comfortably on their border with Israel? I don't hear anyone criticizing them.

Where is the blame to the UN, who were brought in specifically to guard that border and prevent hamas from reestablishing bases there after Israel left Lebanon, for allowing Hamas to settle in comfortably again on their border with Israel? I don't hear anyone criticizing them.

Where is the blame to the Palestinians, Hamas and Hezbollah for constantly using children, women, schools and private homes as shields and suicide bombers? I don't hear anyone criticizing them.

And lastly, where is the sense of fair criticism between the Israelis targeted bombings in Lebanon (albeit with some mistakes) as opposed to the random shelling of Hamas? At least the Israelis were aiming for military targets as opposed to civilians like hamas did.

The extent of the world's criticism in Israel's favor has been to withdraw funding from Hamas because they refuse to recognize Israel, though many have begun reconsidering that.

Now I'm not saying that the Israelis have done no wrong. They've done plenty and their anger and frustration tends to result in their overreacting at times, but until you've lived under constant shelling with weekly suicide bombers (who are men, women and children nowadays :( ) all the while surrounded by your enemies who are quite vocal about wanting to destroy your country and your people, I believe you should withhold your one-sided criticism.

Just because it's easier for the world to criticize the Israelis, whether it's due to fear of your own muslim populations (I'm looking at you Europe) or because you'd have a better chance to make progress with a democratic Israeli government as opposed to the monarchies and dictators of most of the other middle eastern countries, doesn't make it right.

And I'm not even getting into the financial reasons many countries may have to side with the arabic countries as opposed to Israel...I'm thinking of France among many others...

Why can't we all just get along?...I wish it were that simple.

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

we all want peace .. what neither side wants is to compromise

watch paradise now .. nice movie nominated for foreign language oscar .. ( is the only oscar i pay attention to )

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

I kinda go with Ruby and Dave here, and for the record: Dave has never denied the shit Israel has pulled, but i'd get fed up in his position too. Especially here in Europe, everyone seems to be pro-palestinian, and there's actually a trend visible in that.

Ruby makes some very valid points with which I can only totally agree, and I'm getting tired of people that use innocent people as a human shield and kill at random for their cause playing the victim card.

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hey, if you have a moderate amount of intelligence and pay attention, there is minimal blame to isreal, you can blame them for Over-reacting at times, but you cant blame them for reacting. thier people are killed and kidnapped in the name of gaza, and they go after the perps.

fuck hezzboallah and hamas, they are the only two organziations on the plaent to openly say they will use terrorism to attain thier goals, and i wonder why no one finds fault with it...and fuck iran too, today they held yet another anit isreali rally where a few thousand people showed up and burned effigies, and encouraged more suicide bombings.

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and the only time the two organizations stop open fighting is when they are about to be eradicated. so they stop, call a truce to re-arm, wait awhile, then start again. the world made a huge mistake calling for the truce, they should have let isreal fight these groups until they were gone. and SHAME on egypt, a country who, in recent times, takes a bit of high ground politically and stays out of it, but when you are hosting the leadership of these groups, you share blame.

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oh PS. bulululu has no concept of who attacks and who reacts in regards to isreal. i personally think he beleives the arabs are the true historical people from that land.

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

Even overreacting...It has time and time again been proven that the moment Israel relaxes a bit they get jumped. The only way to keep surrounding militias/organizations/countries off their backs is to show that you.dont.fuck.with.Israel. Period.

This will autmatically mean heavy responses to shit like that shelling from Lebanon...

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

bululu, if me and a few thousand of my armed bretheren were sitting in milan, launching rockets at your shit hole haven for criminals and pedophiles, and italy was sitting back enjoying the show, what in the world would you want the swiss gov't to do>? mind you, im a civilian firing them from the center of a city

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

i still think your aproach to the conflict wont fix anything

and to tell you the truth i found dave remarks insulting

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[QUOTE=Miguel;405133]i still think your aproach to the conflict wont fix anything

and to tell you the truth i found dave remarks insulting[/QUOTE] I could see the frustration in what he's saying, but, just out of curiousity, which part of his response was insulting to you? I see where he's insulted bululu for good cause...to pick to argue with only half the point is taking him out of context and unfair.

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

miguel, how old are you. just wondering.

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Will see then if no one won't fuck with Isreal very soon.

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[QUOTE=Bululu;405240]Will see then if no one won't fuck with Isreal very soon.[/QUOTE] Isn't your country supposed to be neutral? and yet you seem to be filled with more wrath than anyone here...interesting.

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

[quote=davetlv;404747]And then you would be showing your complete and utter stupidity wouldnt you Jan.

Does the wishey washey European liberal need to be shown the differences or can you figure them out by yourself?[/quote]whatever dude, biiiiiig whatever :roll:

If you're starting to say stuff like "10, 20, 50 palestinians dead, who cares?" you're on the same rock bottom level as the scum on the other side of the fence. At least your prime minister had the decency to admit it was a fuck up.

But what do I know? I don't cheer when a casualty is added to the list on either side, so I gotta be... what was it again? Ow yeah "complete and utter stupid."

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

[quote=rubyraks;405243]Isn't your country supposed to be neutral? and yet you seem to be filled with more wrath than anyone here...interesting.[/quote]

Geneva is the Dubai of Europe

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

[QUOTE=Localizer;405310]Geneva is the Dubai of Europe[/QUOTE] Please explain. :what

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

[quote=rubyraks;405331]Please explain. :what[/quote]

wealth & dirty laundry.

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

[QUOTE=Localizer;405336]wealth & dirty laundry.[/QUOTE] I see.

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

so that makes Washington DC the Dubay of the US, right? :p

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[quote=KinKyJ;405344]so that makes Washington DC the Dubay of the US, right? :p[/quote]

Hmmmm, ya I guess, but aren't there any big time communities out there that are worse than DC? Houston maybe?

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

[QUOTE=KinKyJ;405344]so that makes Washington DC the Dubay of the US, right? :p[/QUOTE] Only Northwest D.C. ;)

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

Dave may have seemed blunt in his remarks, but i'd react the same if people are blindy taking sides with the other every damn time. Why the fuck is Israel always defending, and does everyone just out of convenience ignore the much dirtier tactics used by Hamas and Hezbollah? At least Israel has a policiy of trying to avoid civilian casualties, Hamas and Hezbollah aim for that n both sides: Israelian for their cause, Arabian/Palestinian to point a finger at those 'heartless jews killing innocent people'. It's the fucking Palestinians putting their kids in the line of fire, not the Israelians.

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

Ruby I just happen to live here, I am not Swiss., and to move away from the subject. Geneva is a corrupted City but you don't see it (nonetheless its an amazing little city to live in) , it all happens in Offices where 99% of us never dream of entering.

Re: So the IDF fucked up again

[quote=Yao;405382]Dave may have seemed blunt in his remarks, but i'd react the same if people are blindy taking sides with the other every damn time. Why the fuck is Israel always defending, and does everyone just out of convenience ignore the much dirtier tactics used by Hamas and Hezbollah? At least Israel has a policiy of trying to avoid civilian casualties, Hamas and Hezbollah aim for that n both sides: Israelian for their cause, Arabian/Palestinian to point a finger at those 'heartless jews killing innocent people'. It's the fucking Palestinians putting their kids in the line of fire, not the Israelians.[/quote]

They're both heartless because they've let faith lead them down the path of destruction.