[quote=Civic_Zen][quote=Jenks]fuck ghandi. :lol:[/quote]

:HolyShit: :RockOn: :RockOn:[/quote]

[img]http://i.timeinc.net/time/time100/images/main_gandhi.jpg[/img]

Time 100 - Leaders and Revolutionaries

What, then, is greatness? In what does it reside? If a man's project fails, or survives only in irredeemably tarnished form, can the force of his example still merit the extreme accolade? For Jawaharlal Nehru, the defining image of Gandhi was "as I saw him marching, staff in hand, to Dandi on the Salt March in 1930. Here was the pilgrim on his quest of Truth, quiet, peaceful, determined and fearless, who would continue that quest and pilgrimage, regardless of consequences." Nehru's daughter Indira Gandhi later said, "More than his words, his life was his message." These days, that message is better heeded outside India. Albert Einstein was one of many to praise Gandhi's achievement; Martin Luther King Jr., the Dalai Lama and all the world's peace movements have followed in his footsteps. Gandhi, who gave up cosmopolitanism to gain a country, has become, in his strange afterlife, a citizen of the world: his spirit may yet prove resilient, smart, tough, sneaky and, yes, ethical enough to avoid assimilation by global McCulture (and Mac culture too). Against this new empire, Gandhian intelligence is a better weapon than Gandhian piety. And passive resistance? We'll see.

[url]http://www.time.com/time/time100/leaders/profile/gandhi.html[/url]

ghandi doesn't pay my mortgage.

[quote=Jenks]fuck ghandi. :lol:[/quote]

Jenks, you disappoint me. Now why would you want to fuck someone like Gandhi. You are one sick man... :WinkNSmi:

And regarding your mortgage, nobody pays it but yourself. :lol:

But Gandhi should trully deserve some respect, as he was probably one of the "most successful" peaceful men in the history of the world... So saying fuck him is really not nice.

And god damnit, I still can't figure out which american pres killed more people than Sadam... :?

[quote=brakada][quote=Jenks]fuck ghandi. :lol:[/quote]

Jenks, you disappoint me. Now why would you want to fuck someone like Gandhi. You are one sick man... :WinkNSmi:

And regarding your mortgage, nobody pays it but yourself. :lol:

But Gandhi should trully deserve some respect, as he was probably one of the "most successful" peaceful men in the history of the world... So saying fuck him is really not nice.

And god damnit, I still can't figure out which american pres killed more people than Sadam... :?[/quote] dont know about ghandi being a killer, but sadam is definetly the bigest killer alive and hope that to be in the past bush administration and usa did nothing but to make peace in a country with a terror regim ruled by sadam"s people so if u count the inocent people killed by no meaning, u ll find sadam , the worst dictator ever to be alive :MadNow:

[quote=qwerty2222]if u count the inocent people killed by no meaning, u ll find sadam , the worst dictator [b]ever[/b] to be alive :MadNow:[/quote]

Sorry, to correct you, but do the words Hitler and Stalin mean anything to you? "Their" bodycount will be forever very hard to "beat"...

...or maybe not. NUKE CHINA :WinkNSmi: j/k

[quote=brakada][quote=qwerty2222]if u count the inocent people killed by no meaning, u ll find sadam , the worst dictator [b]ever[/b] to be alive :MadNow:[/quote]

Sorry, to correct you, but do the words Hitler and Stalin mean anything to you? "Their" bodycount will be forever very hard to "beat"...

...or maybe not. NUKE CHINA :WinkNSmi: j/k[/quote] ok, if u want to correct me... one of the worst dictators ever to be alive

[quote=qwerty2222] ok, if u want to correct me... one of the worst dictators ever to be alive[/quote]

:Bingo: That's better... :wink:

[quote=brakada]But Gandhi should trully deserve some respect, as he was probably one of the "most successful" peaceful men in the history of the world... So saying fuck him is really not nice. [/quote]

No, he didn't really mean it. It was just a "standard Republican diversion tactic" to avoid answering the hard questions.

Re:: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

Bush, defenitely

[quote=brakada] And god damnit, I still can't figure out which american pres killed more people than Sadam... :?[/quote]

Harry S Truman.

^^^^ I still think that Sadam killed more people than the American nukes... I think Sadam's death toll can be measured in millions, while Truman could be held responsible "only" for a couple hundred thousand of deaths... :lol: :wink:

Re:: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

Henry Kissinger wasn't even a president and he's probably responsible for more deaths than Saddam - the carpet-bombing of Cambodia killed millions, courtesy of Kissinger :MadNow:

^in terms of numbers...Hitler killed 6 million + jews, and that's only the jews...doesn't even factor the rest of the people he killed in war.

he's the worst imo.

Re:: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

[quote=mixu]Henry Kissinger wasn't even a president and he's probably responsible for more deaths than Saddam - the carpet-bombing of Cambodia killed millions, courtesy of Kissinger :MadNow:[/quote]

It's kind of ironic that Kissinger was originally nominated to be chairman of the 9/11 commission. ;)

Re:: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

[quote=krelm][quote=mixu]Henry Kissinger wasn't even a president and he's probably responsible for more deaths than Saddam - the carpet-bombing of Cambodia killed millions, courtesy of Kissinger :MadNow:[/quote]

It's kind of ironic that Kissinger was originally nominated to be chairman of the 9/11 commission. ;)[/quote]

And that he won the 1973 Nobel Peace Prize!

Re:: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

[quote=krelm] It's kind of ironic that Kissinger was originally nominated to be chairman of the 9/11 commission. ;)[/quote]

I thought he WAS the 9/11 chairman and then resigned due to all the controversy.

Re:: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

[quote=delirious][quote=krelm] It's kind of ironic that Kissinger was originally nominated to be chairman of the 9/11 commission. ;)[/quote]

I thought he WAS the 9/11 chairman and then resigned due to all the controversy.[/quote]

Yeah, he quit after 16 days due to 'conflicts of interest'... I think being wanted for war crimes should have shown up on his 'CV'.

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

[quote=davetlv]^^^^^ You're a funny man!

Mmm lets see, one man came to power against the wishes of his people, systematically carried out a program of ethnic cleansing against some of his own people, mass murder of his opponents, caused the death of millions of people due to war and funding of terrorist activity, and the other is a democratically elected leader.

Difficult, will have to get back to you on this one![/quote]

Who put him there though. Im not agreeing with anyone. Just posing the question.

Re: : who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

[QUOTE=Miguel_303]Hi friends!!. I know that u dont like my question. But its my opinion. This a place when u can give your opinion. My opinion is diferent to your north american and imperialist vision. For me United State goverment is a imperialist country and kill whem they want oil or some resources (Afganistan, Irak, Somalia) . England goverment ve a a similar exterior politic. (Malvinas War with Argentina, under drugs effects soldiers england violate soldiers Argentinos (Ernesto Sabato ). Its true they dont kill as Saddam. They say we are the liberty troops, etc etc. We ve to wait some years then we will see "the american fall". Thanks Michael Moore. U cry because son many people die in New York iin Madrid, but thousands of children and woman die in Orient all days. Do u cry for them? No. Why ? They re not american civils or europeans. And i repeat: reagan, clinton, bush = saddam .[/QUOTE]

You asked an honest question, though many here may not like it. I don't like Bush at all, but IMO Saddam is the bigger prick of the two.

To the rest: people are allowed to ask questions, look at yourself first before bashing this guy, and take into account he comes form a part of the world where people are mainly anti-Bush and propaganda is more inclined to demonize Bush than Saddam even perhaps. If you think the question is a stupid one, educate the guy in a respectful way please and refrain from simple brainless laughing and bashing as if you yourself inherited the world's wisdom.

An honest question deserves an honest answer.

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

:Gay:

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

fuck you very much dear Jenks :D

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

This is very complicated situation.In big politics like the politics leaded by U>S>A and Iraq if you say for example "He is guilty more" or "He is the baddest" you wont be right at all.I dont want to take long so i will just say this: There is lots of reasons USA to attack Iraq,one of the biggest is that the big bad wolf must satisfy his hunger by eating lambs and guess what,the lamb is Iraq- large resources they have,petrol i mean.On the opposite there is peaceful bullshit going on CNN in sort of : "USA must stop that terorrist SAddam" and many people believe it but they must open their eyes: Yes, saddam is terorist and dictator but thats not the real reasion for all........economic rules and globalisation is the answer

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

...and your comments on Saddam, other than him being a terrorist and a dictator? No more words on him? Wow...balanced views rule!

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

[quote=Yao]...and your comments on Saddam, other than him being a terrorist and a dictator? No more words on him? Wow...balanced views rule![/quote]

He was a good man who loved his family. . . . apart from those that he killed :lol: :lol: :lol:

Cant believe this shit has been revived. . . .

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

[quote=Yao]...and your comments on Saddam, other than him being a terrorist and a dictator? No more words on him? Wow...balanced views rule![/quote] A man raised in that country,a man who had the absolute power above his nation,above his sovereign,a man who kills people. But look,Bush is killer too,and Bush gives the hole world the imagination of chasing the bad guys instead of going on his own purpose.And yes,Bush is a killer too....

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

I can't believe this thread got resurrected after all this time. I posted in it and didn't even remember doing it...I thought it was a new thead. :lol:

[quote=Yao]...and your comments on Saddam, other than him being a terrorist and a dictator? No more words on him? Wow...balanced views rule![/quote] So let me get this straight...you want a balanced view on Saddam Hussein?? Let me go ahead and ask you what your "balanced" view of him is?? Great family man, killer poker player, shitty tipper?? I can't wait to hear this.

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

I thought it was clear from that remark that if I thought Bush was a killer, I would place Saddam in the same league. Which I do. I'm not French, you know :D

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

So your "balanced" view is that Bush and Saddam are both killers...period, end of story?? The number, reasons or manner in which those they have inflicted death upon don't even enter the equation??

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

Haven't I pointed those out enough alrady elsewhere? Geez, I thought you know what I thought of the guys by now.

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

Man, I stayed away from this politics forum for about a year. I don't remember much of what anyone thought.

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

"Only the great men know the great politics....And only the great men know what it takes to be on the top"..

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

both are piece of shit, the first is a butcher who brought all poverty and death to his country and the second is a butcher with the muslim people, more than 10 million people, most are civilians, 1.x milion babies were killed in Iraq since 1991 and he is an idiot with his country, bringing hate and isolation for his country

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

So by those numbers nearly 40% of the Iraqi population has been killed in this war and in Gulf War I.:lol:

Certainly Goerbels is alive and well, and is working for the socialist world order. What a joke modern media must be when people have such horribly incorrect information.

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

Very similar in comparison...but I think Bush has some extra browny points.

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

This has the potential to be an interesting informed discussion guys:

1. Can we all agree that, as a result of US foreign policy, there have been untold millions of deaths of military personnel and civilians?

2. As the #1 nation in the world in 99% of things (money, power etc) the US could use it's clout to improve conditions for the less-deprived areas of the world. I'm not saying they don't do it now, I'm sure that billions are spent each year helping others, but for example by refusing to recognise the genocide law they are not exactly improving their standing.

3. The US supported and helped install Saddam in Iraq. When he got too big for his boots and invaded Kuwait they went to war with him. The UN, at the behest of the US, imposed sanctions stopping all supplies to Iraq - for over 10 years despite the war being 'won' quite quickly. As a result of that 500,000 children alone died because they could not get food, medicine etc.

So there is some comparison. Discuss

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

1. i wouldnt say millions. my brother is ARMY and he says its really bad but it aint millions. most iraqi deaths are from the """insurgency""

2. why give handouts when you can use it to improve ur position? i know the thought may be deemed not nice by some, but its common sense. government after all is a business. and frankly, its the only way for countries to work together.

3. i hate sounding cruel, but why didnt the citizens do anything for temselves to get rid of saddam when he did the damage. AND what kind of leader allows his people to starve just to maintain a fearsome foothold upon them ---just advocate thoughts. not neccessarily opinion. but trying to be fair. there is a lot more to it than the 3 questions above.

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

I'm not sure what to answer on this one.

For killing as a way of living i should say Saddam. He has obviously been cruel to his very own people.

For the number of deaths i think probably Saddam wins too.

So it should be Saddam.

But what worries me about this topic that Saddam is being lighted again as WORLDS worst dictator. That is what Media and the US wants us to believe. What about the Charles Taylor's and Robert Mugabe's of this world. Mugabe who is still on the lead has probably made more deaths than Saddam. And think of Charles Taylor..somehow it doesn't really seem to bother the people i know that he has been finally captured. Hardly any of my friends know him at all.

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

sightless my comment at #1 referred to total US foreign policy not just Iraq. So I'm including Cambodia, Nicaragua, East Timor, Iraq, Afghanistan, Vietnam etc.

You could take the view of 'strengthening your own position' but how strong do you want to be? The US is probably unsurpassable in military spending, technology, weapons etc. It reminds me of the Itchy & Scratchy sketch in the Simpsons where itchy pulls a gun, scratchy a bigger gun, then Itchy a gun thats the size of the US, then Scratchy a gun the size of the world and BANG the whole world is blown up.

We don't know exactly what is happening in Iraw or what happened. It wasn't just a case of Saddam as a sole person who inflicted death. He instructed his army generals etc to do that - and I'm pretty sure if I knew my boss would shoot me if i didn't do what he said i'd probably do what he said.

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

[quote=GregWhelan]

3. The US supported and helped install Saddam in Iraq.

So there is some comparison. Discuss[/quote]

Where did you get that fact? Saddam took over himself and took power from his uncle and then killed anyone he felt was a threat. We only helped him fight Iran who we were also helping fight Iraq.

Saddam is directly responsible for the killing of over 100,000 people. He made the order to kill them. He is also responsible for the largest literacy campaign in the worlds history. Go figure, he wanted everyone to read in his country.

Saddam being directly responsible, he is a killer. Now Bush is no saint. Bush was given a second chance to make some change and he fucked it up. Each day when another Amercian soldier dies or an Iraqi civilian gets killed, I hope Bush pays for it in some way.

BTW, hey sightless, how long has your brother been there?

Re: who is more killer Saddam or Bush?

I cannot remember the exact book (I would have gotten it from the library because it certainly isn't on my shelf) but i do remember reading that the US provided funds to help facilitate Saddam's rise to power, and that they fully supported his intsallation/rise to power.

They also were aware of his poisoning of his own people when it occurred and turned a blind eye - now they use that fact to 'demonise' him in the media.