Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

uh, no I was thinking the university. there IS an issue of foresight imo. did the university act appropriately to protect students just after the first shooting in the dorm? From the looks, 'no' seems to be the answer. All they did was send out an e-mail telling students to be aware. Which, of course, does not mean every student read those e-mails. It's kinda iffy though.

Think about this: the first two fatalities were reported around 7:15am. Then the spree continued at around 9:45. The school didn't even cancel classes till well after 10am, and nothing was done, it appears, save for the e-mail, between the first and second shooting. imho, that whole campus should have been shut down and police sent to secure the rest of the campus. but they only secured that one dorm. and 30 more innocent victims fell just after....

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

yeah i and alot of people have been saying that, i guess the investigation will uncover that. the police thinking i think was that this was a small shooting and that the killer had gone off campus and was finished. the thinking is where do we draw the line when something like this happens? everytime someone calls in a bomb threat, or someone gets shot they were not wanting to shut down the whole town. but in hindsight that is what they should have done, i agree with what you are saying......

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

its very easy to say 'they should have done this or that' after the fact, but the reality is...no one ever thinks someone is gonna go on a mass murder rampage. isolated shootings happen all the damn time, especially in the states...how many of them lead to a guy going ape shit with pistols? it just doesn't enter into the thought process of the normal individual.

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

[quote=MJ;475513]Why does this always seem to happen at a school in the US?[/quote]Find the answer to that question on the NRA website...

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

I found this on godhatesamerica.com...

[QUOTE][FONT=Verdana][COLOR=#0000ff]WBC will preach at the funerals of the Virginia Tech students killed on campus during a shooting rampage April 16, 2007. You describe this as monumental horror, but you know nothing of horror -- yet. Your bloody tyrant Bush says he is 'horrified' by it all. You know nothing of horror -- yet. Your true horror is coming. "[I]They shall also gird themselves with sackloth, and horror shall cover them; and shame shall be upon all faces, and baldness upon all their heads[/I]" (Eze. 7:18). [/COLOR][/FONT] [FONT=Verdana][COLOR=#0000ff]Why did this happen, you ask? It's simple. Your military chose to shoot at the servants of God today, and all they got for their effort was terror. Then, the LORD your God sent a crazed madman to shoot at your children. Was God asleep while this took place? Was He on vacation? Of course not. He willed this to happen to punish you for assailing His servants.[/COLOR][/FONT][/QUOTE]Someone kick those people. Really hard. In the teeth.

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

Seriously fucked up - thank god our UK guncrime is strictly minor division.

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

Now here's something that I have yet to see reported in the mainstream media. Earlier this year the Virginia General Assembly failed to act on House Bill 1572. The citizens of Virginia are permitted to carry concealed weapons if they get a proper permit from the state government --- unless you are on a college campus. This bill would have allowed college students and employees to carry handguns on campus --- with appropriate permits, of course. It died in subcommittee. After the bill was thrown out up steps Larry Hincker, a spokesman for Virginia Tech, the site of today's carnage, who says "I'm sure the university community is appreciative of the General Assembly's actions because this will help parents, students, faculty and visitors feel safe on our campus."

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

i still think that is valid, i wouldn't want college kids my age when i was on campus carrying concealed weapons. too many drunk young dumbasses who if they happen to have a gun might do something stupid.

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

[QUOTE=thesightless;475768]ugh,,, the bullshit is already starting. and yes, the bullshit. [URL]http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,266460,00.html[/URL][/QUOTE]

[quote]...the worst mass-murder shooting in American history.[/quote] I hate when people say shit like this. "the best ever" or "the worst ever." the news is the worst. they never do research. I just searched 5 minutes on wikipedia and found dozens of american shootings of more than 30 people people. I hate the news. they're killing us.

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_massacres[/url]

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

Hey all just thought i would put my 2 cents in... I am sad to hear the news bout what happened.. my thoughts a pray's are with the families and friends of those dead.. I just wanted to ask you guys that do live in the states.. how easyis it to own a gun/ rifile?? how much do they cost and can any jo blow of the street walk into a shop and get a gun?? do they not do checks on anyone?

The reason i ask is cause ont the news over hear i heard that anyone in the US can own a gun without any check's etc.. Another thing why does this happen so much in the US..my opinion is this gun control plain and simple.. if everyone walks around with guns and guns are so accessiable then of course this is gonna happen. Cause people get paranoid ..i saw the bush speach and frankly it hmm it was not good. If this happened to his kids or people he loved i bet he would change the rules. Anyway just my 2 cents.. RIP to all those that have lost their lives

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

[QUOTE=picklemonkey;475977]I hate when people say shit like this. "the best ever" or "the worst ever." the news is the worst. they never do research. I just searched 5 minutes on wikipedia and found dozens of american shootings of more than 30 people people. I hate the news. they're killing us.

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_massacres[/url][/QUOTE]

biggest school shooting death toll i think it was

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

to reply to johns question-

No you can't just go buy a gun. There are background checks. 7 days. But the process is fairly simple. If you have any criminal background, you can't own a gun. The thing is tho, criminals already have guns, that's why they're criminals, duh!

I have a gun or two. I've never killed anyone. Shocking right? Used to be into hunting. Not so much anymore, but still have the guns. Not getting rid of them either.

It would have been nice if yeah, we didn't ever have guns, i'd be all for that. But we're past that now, because we already have them, and more importantly, criminals will always have them no matter what laws you put in place. So i'll be keeping my guns thanks, because the bad guys have them too. Doesn't make me one spark away from killing 33 people tho on a college campus. The world is full of idiots. Guns or not, people like that are going to find a way to hurt people or do stupid shit. You can make a pipe bomb with simple household materials that would easily kill just as many people. Point is, lunatics are lunatics. Trying to implement gun laws in this country [U]now [/U]is a ridiculous idea, it's not going to work. A few hundred years late on that idea.

Saw this T shirt once, cracked me up- [B] Guns don't kill people, Mario Van Peebles. [/B]

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

[quote=johns;475981]The reason i ask is cause ont the news over hear i heard that anyone in the US can own a gun without any check's etc.. [/quote]

I have to question the quality of your news sources... Don't just rely on info from people whose opinion of America is formed solely on the basis of watching Baywatch reruns.

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

^^^ hey mate i watched on the news hear.. and they said something like BLACKSBURG, Va. is one of the easiest places to get guns with no check or anything in the US.. hey i am just going by what was said on the news and wanted to findout if thats true.

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

[quote=picklemonkey;475977]I hate when people say shit like this. "the best ever" or "the worst ever." the news is the worst. they never do research. I just searched 5 minutes on wikipedia and found dozens of american shootings of more than 30 people people. I hate the news. they're killing us.

[URL]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_massacres[/URL][/quote]

yeah .. when they say worst ever it opens the door for another crazy fuck to try and beat the record

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

jenks is right and that any type of gun control laws are way late in the making, there are way too many of them here in the us to even try and get rid of any, i think the more important thing to understand is why there are gun rampages like this in the us more than any other country in the world. what is it about americans that makes us do these things more than people from other cultures?

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

[quote=res0nat0r;476005]what is it about americans that makes us do these things more than people from other cultures?[/quote]

I just think Americans as a whole have too much choice from food to guns to just about everything. Everything in moderation i say. I mean when theres shows like this one glorifying gunculture on the history channel u gotta ask questions.

Normal civilians should not be aloud own miniguns, flamethrowers and bloody tanks... WTF! :what

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4UtosDFNNP8[/youtube]

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

ARGH!!!!

someone on MSNBC just opened pandora's box...

not a direct quote but here is the gist....

-----the shooter was a resident alien, when will the gov't wake up to the problem of we dont know who we are letting the in country these days.......

STFU plz.

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

be careful, I am a resident alien

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

me too :)

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

I think this just goes to show that everybody needs to carry a gun. The problem here wasn't the police it was the fact that 1 guy had a gun and 26,000 others didn't.. Arm the masses that is what you were founded on...

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

[quote=Mr.Big;476056]I just think Americans as a whole have too much choice from food to guns to just about everything. Everything in moderation i say. I mean when theres shows like this one glorifying gunculture on the history channel u gotta ask questions.

Normal civilians should not be aloud own miniguns, flamethrowers and bloody tanks... WTF! :what

[youtube]4UtosDFNNP8[/youtube][/quote]

WTF indeed.. So let me get this straight.. these asshats have these machine guns at home and these people get invited to shoot shit with kids watching and standing around. then people get to go on tanks, have a go on flam throwers shoot cannons and shit.. Now is it just me or does anyone else see the reason why things like what happened yesterday HAPPENED.. Seriously WTF indeed.. So what happens when one of these parents who own these machine guns and all say their kid has a bad day at school and decide to oh well ya know take one with them.. I am sure it has happened before..

Also somone mentioned that criminal records are done and all. so my point is this. if lets say JOE BLOW walks in to a store and tries to buy a gun. then they do a check which lasts 7 days or whatever. then they find out that JOE BLOW is a criminal.. now should that not be reported to the cops .. that this JOE BLOW is trying to purchase a gun and he has a criminal record. Do you guys see what i am trying to get at here..

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

[URL="http://www.bithq.org/redir.php?url=http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/4371403.stm"][COLOR=#0000ff]Timeline: US school shootings[/COLOR][/URL]

April 2007: A gunman shoots dead at least 20 people at the campus of Virginia Tech university in Virginia.

October 2006: A 32-year-old gunman shoots dead at least five girls at an Amish school in Pennsylvania, before killing himself

September 2006: Gunman in Colorado shoots and fatally wounds a teenage schoolgirl, then kills himself; two days later a teenager kills the headteacher of a school in Cazenovia, Wisconsin

November 2005: Student in Tennessee shoots dead an assistant principal and wounds two other administrators

March 2005: Minnesota schoolboy kills nine, then shoots himself

May 2004: Four people injured in shooting at a school in Maryland

April 2003: Teenager shoots dead head-teacher at a Pennsylvania school, then kills himself

March 2001: Pupil opens fire at a school in California, killing two students

February 2000: Six-year-old girl shot dead by classmate in Michigan

November 1999: Thirteen-year-old girl shot dead by a classmate in New Mexico

May 1999: Student injures six pupils in shoot-out in Georgia

April 1999: Two teenagers shoot dead 12 students and a teacher before killing themselves at Columbine School in Colorado

June 1998: Two adults hurt in shooting by teenage student at high school in Virginia

May 1998: Fifteen-year-old boy shoots himself in the head after taking a girl hostage

May 1998: Fifteen-year-old shoots dead two students in school cafeteria in Oregon

April 1998: Fourteen-year-old shoots dead a teacher and wounds two students in Pennsylvania

March 1998: Two boys, 11 and 13, kill four girls and a teacher in Arkansas

December 1997: Fourteen-year-old boy kills three students in Kentucky

October 1997: Sixteen-year-old boy stabs mother, then shoots dead two students at school in Mississippi, injuring several others

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

gun laws dont do shit. you think if someone wants to go on a rampage in france, they cant go and find guns on the street? of course they can. i wish we could all carry guns to school and everyone else so that next time a fuckass wants to go on a rampage he gets shot right away.

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

How can you say gun laws dont do shit mate.. where i live Australia there are gun laws and control.. and even though the population is not like the US there is hardly ever any shootings in Aus.. I bet give it like 7months and there prob will be another shooting in America.. that is the trend it seems have taken.. And yes people can get guns on the street if they tried i am not saying they cant.. its all about accesability is it not..what i am saying is the more people carrying them the more shootings accidents etc ..And yes maybe it is too hard to do something bout it now so as somone mentioned why now make the price of bullets alot more expensive or something.. i mean these fatcats get all the money in parliment they should think of the ideas and run the country properly.. Anyway thats all.. bye

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

Australia - port arthur shootings. only 35 people killed. you rest your case

regardless of any laws and/or prices, these guys would have killed at will. they would have found a way.

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

[quote=johns;476134]How can you say gun laws dont do shit mate.. where i live Australia there are gun laws and control.. and even though the population is not like the US there is hardly ever any shootings in Aus.. I bet give it like 7months and there prob will be another shooting in America.. that is the trend it seems have taken.. And yes people can get guns on the street if they tried i am not saying they cant.. its all about accesability is it not..what i am saying is the more people carrying them the more shootings accidents etc ..And yes maybe it is too hard to do something bout it now so as somone mentioned why now make the price of bullets alot more expensive or something.. i mean these fatcats get all the money in parliment they should think of the ideas and run the country properly.. Anyway thats all.. bye[/quote]

We have the same laws here in canada but we are seeing more and more shooting from gangs in Toronto.. it is spreading to my town of Windsor as well.. Soon it will be the same in Australia.. I think everybody should have a gun and learn how to use it so people just don't go around shooting people.. Training should be the big issue not disarming.

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

[quote=shosh;476149]Australia - port arthur shootings. only 35 people killed. you rest your case

regardless of any laws and/or prices, these guys would have killed at will. they would have found a way.[/quote]

wrong. gun control DOES work.

you add the populations of Great Britain, Canada, Australia, Sweden, Germany, and you have roughly the population of the US.

gun deaths in those countries TOTAL every year: a couple hundred.

gun deaths in the US: around 50,000.

Please explain the difference without using gun control laws...

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

^ yup, that proves it!!!

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

[quote=Jenks;475994] I have a gun or two. I've never killed anyone. Shocking right?[/quote]

I'm going to look into getting a gun soon. Why? Cuz going to the range and shooting targets seems like fun and a cool test of skill. Simple as that. I'm sure that makes me a gun-crazed, psycho....but whatever. [IMG]http://www.treehouseofdeath.com/forum/images/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif[/IMG]

[quote=Jenks;475994] It would have been nice if yeah, we didn't ever have guns, i'd be all for that. But we're past that now, because we already have them, and more importantly, criminals will always have them no matter what laws you put in place. So i'll be keeping my guns thanks, because the bad guys have them too.[/quote]

Exactly!!!

If guns are illegal the only people that [I]won't[/I] have them are the ones who actually need them. Criminals will get them either way...so why make the general population into target practice? What's to stop a criminal from breaking into someone's house and robbing/raping/killing them if they know for a fact that the owner doesn't have a gun? The problem is the black market....there are "gun highways" stretching all over the country. I'm not totally sure so don't quote me, but didn't Australia's murder and assault rates go [B]up[/B] after their new laws were implemented? So...please tell me...how is getting rid of LEGAL guns going to resolve this?

Also...I love the "Why does this only happen in the US?" line. Some kid (probably a transplanted American) just shot up a bunch of people in Canada recently, right? Mexico is run by heavily-armed drug cartels. Darfur is overrun with AK-toting militias. People get killed over freaking soccer in Europe!!! Only in America, right? Or different manifestations of the same problem? But hey...people LOVE piling on the US...so have at it. :roll:

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

[quote=day_for_night;476189]wrong. gun control DOES work.

you add the populations of Great Britain, Canada, Australia, Sweden, Germany, and you have roughly the population of the US.

gun deaths in those countries TOTAL every year: a couple hundred.

gun deaths in the US: around 50,000.

Please explain the difference without using gun control laws...[/quote]

wow thats a very interesting fact you stated.....maybe those countries have the right idea.....

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

• In the United States during 1997, there were 15,289 murders. Of these, 10,369 were committed with firearms.
• In the United States during 1997, there were approximately 7,927,000 violent crimes. Of these, 691,000 were committed with firearms. * Americans use firearms to defend themselves from criminals at least 764,000 times a year. This figure is the lowest among a group of 9 nationwide surveys done by organizations including Gallup and the Los Angeles Times. * In 1982, a survey of imprisoned criminals found that 34% of them had been "scared off, shot at, wounded or captured by an armed victim
• Washington D.C. enacted a virtual ban on handguns in 1976. Between 1976 and 1991, Washington D.C.'s homicide rate rose 200%, while the U.S. rate rose 12%. * Federal law 18 USC Section 922 generally prohibits anyone under 18 from possessing a handgun. It also prohibits licensed firearm dealers and collectors from selling handguns to anyone under 21 years of age.
• Laws in the United States generally prohibit the sale, possession, or use of cocaine. About 200,000 American children, age 12-17 used cocaine in 1997. About 2.5 million 12-17 year olds (11.4%) used an illicit drug in 1997. ([URL]http://www.justfacts.com/gun_control.htm[/URL])

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

[quote=shosh;476227]

• Americans use firearms to defend themselves from criminals at least 764,000 times a year. This figure is the lowest among a group of 9 nationwide surveys done by organizations including Gallup and the Los Angeles Times.
• In 1982, a survey of imprisoned criminals found that 34% of them had been "scared off, shot at, wounded or captured by an armed victim
• Washington D.C. enacted a virtual ban on handguns in 1976. Between 1976 and 1991, Washington D.C.'s homicide rate rose 200%, while the U.S. rate rose 12%. [/quote]

What did someone else just say..."That proves it!!!"

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

ok everyone so check this out...perhaps not surprising, but:

That little fucker had EXACTLY all of the classic signs you'd expect in a person who is going to go nuts and shoot up a classroom.

Completely unfriendly and antisocial, angry a lot, obsessed with violence, wrote disturbing shit, some history of mental illness...you name it, it's there. Apparently he thoroughly creeped the hell out of everyone in his English class with his graphic and disturbing plays handed in for assignments...they even notified school administration about the stuff he wrote. And they all pretty much knew it was him before it was all even figured out and announced.

[URL]http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/04/17/vtech.shooting/index.html[/URL]

Here are links to 2 pretty graphic plays he wrote, along with commentary of a student who was in his class: [URL]http://newsbloggers.aol.com/2007/04/17/cho-seung-huis-plays/[/URL]

And he left the classic psycho letter at his dorm room where he expresses his hatred for pretty much everyone: [URL]http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/04/17/cho.profile/index.html[/URL]

I guess it just goes to show you that there some things you can unfortunately count on when it comes to this kind of crap.

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

Yep...said he was a total loner and was recommend to see a counselor due to some of the fucked up shit he wrote. He was also supposedly on medication for depression. Sounds pretty much like the Columbine guys, right? And you mean to tell me NO ONE saw this coming? :x

But no, man...it's the movies and TV shows and video games and rap music. Cuz you know people can't just be born fucked up...it's got to be something else's fault. :roll:

[quote]When I first heard about the multiple shootings at Virginia Tech yesterday, my first thought was about my friends, and my second thought was "I bet it was Seung Cho."

Cho was in my playwriting class last fall, and nobody seemed to think much of him at first. He would sit by himself whenever possible, and didn't like talking to anyone. I don't think I've ever actually heard his voice before. He was just so quiet and kept to himself. Looking back, he fit the exact stereotype of what one would typically think of as a "school shooter" – a loner, obsessed with violence, and serious personal problems. Some of us in class tried to talk to him to be nice and get him out of his shell, but he refused talking to anyone. It was like he didn't want to be friends with anybody.[/quote]

A lot of good your observations are doing now, dude.

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

[quote=evangelion;476235] But no, man...it's the movies and TV shows and video games and rap music. Cuz you know people can't just be born fucked up...it's got to be something else's fault. :roll:[/quote]

probably too much Starcraft.....

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

Or hell, Super Mario Brothers...that has "violence" in it, right?

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

[quote=evangelion;476244]Or hell, Super Mario Brothers...that has "violence" in it, right?[/quote]

no hes asian, it has to be starcraft

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

Yeah...I forgot, Korea is obsessed with Starcraft.

Re: 20 dead at uni shooting :(

hmmm...and in his dorm room, item related to the manufacture of explosives and various information related to acts of mass destruction and terror. Who would have guessed.

[URL]http://i.a.cnn.net/cnn/2007/images/04/17/warrant.pdf[/URL]