Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

[QUOTE=feather;1137490] But when she is angry, it's a Mr Hyde scenario. She turns on anyone and whoever is at hand or close to her, she looks for things to destroy whether physically or emotionally, herself and around her; it's completely impossible to understand her when she's in that mode because she twists and misinterprets, projects whatever she is thinking or feeling words, read between the lines. It's basically a storm and people can only pick up the pieces. .[/QUOTE]

What exactly does she bring to the relationship that makes up for this? Because frankly, that kind of toxicity would be enough to bring anyone down with them.

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

[QUOTE=feather;1137490]I'm similar ... I was not brought up with an awareness of depression and it's never occurred to me to see anyone about it. I just assumed I was a pessimistic person. The only way I can describe it is being in a state of low-energy flatline although in the past I've had what might be extreme highs and downs, I don't have anything to compare it to.

But I don't affect the people around me and no one has ever mentioned anything to me so I don't think I'm exhibiting anything extreme. Maybe because I've had to deal with my ex over the years who is actually diagnosed with bi-polar among a host of other issues and I've cauterized myself from her extremities to the point that I just don't react much to anything. My colleagues actually think I'm really calm and zen.

What bothers me is this general perception of depressed people being mopy and down. I can deal with that, I think it's 'easier' to be sympathetic and 'be there' for the person and if that person can at times come out of it to see they are not alone.

I don't know what other cases of depression are like because when you read about it in the media it always paints the person deserving of sympathy and a victim.

My experience with my ex has been different. She oscillates between down and angry and despair. When she is down she shuts off and needs her own space, when she despairs she is sometimes able to communicate and I've tried to talk her through it. But when she is angry, it's a Mr Hyde scenario. She turns on anyone and whoever is at hand or close to her, she looks for things to destroy whether physically or emotionally, herself and around her; it's completely impossible to understand her when she's in that mode because she twists and misinterprets, projects whatever she is thinking or feeling words, read between the lines. It's basically a storm and people can only pick up the pieces.

I don't know if depression is simply narrowly defined as people in that mental state of being down but like I said, my own experience has included more than that and frankly paints a different picture of how the media has portrayed it. The person is a victim of the condition but not necessarily accessible, helpable, and is actually antagonistic towards help.

When a celebrity dies and depression is part of it, we get a sympathetic picture of the situation. And it certainly is. But my own experience makes me wonder if there are other sides to the situation that we don't all see.[/QUOTE]

There most certainly are other sides and unfortunately people like you who try to understand and be there are the people that are bearing the brunt of those other sides.

I have no idea what to do about this but wish you all the luck in the world.

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

The media and films depict depression unrealistically just as they do most all mental illness & most life experiences, therefore, myths exist and will continue to until dialog & education are widely offered/accepted:

Maybe a bit over-simplified, but accurate:

[URL]http://www.forbes.com/sites/daviddisalvo/2014/08/12/five-common-myths-about-depression/[/URL]

@Feather, maybe your ex has undiagnosed PTSD (7.7 million people suffer from it) which makes her unable to maintain close relationships if they trigger her symptoms unknowingly. Sometimes people unknowingly have patterns of behavior that trigger symptoms of a PTSD sufferer. The reason I'm suggesting this is because you described her as sometimes inaccessible, antagonistic to being helped, at times raging with anger, etc.

With PTSD, depression is one component. I don't know how old she is or anything about her past, but if she's pretty young, even 30ish, it could be she's unable to identify what triggers her and what soothes her traumatized brain (if she's been traumatized by something). A journal is really helpful. If those who love her take time to learn what triggers her and what helps her, that can lead her on her way to being open to help because she'll feel compassion & cared for. We all have buttons that can get pushed, but with PTSD sufferers, their buttons glare & get punched, and result in the breakdown of relationships, which in turns, makes them feel worse and is a vicious/disastrous cycle*.

Compassion is always helpful. Calling anyone toxic, like a chemical/gas is described, is objectifying them & cruel. There are solutions to PTSD, some of which are currently pretty new and innovative, and not widely known, which is sad since so many military personnel suffer from it. Two people can experience the same event and one can categorize it one way, while another develops PTSD. Many components go into developing PTSD. Anyway, there are treatment options not listed in this article, but this seems like an accurate one to consider*:

[URL]http://www.ptsd.va.gov/public/family/ptsd-and-relationships.asp[/URL]

*There are PTSD sufferers that find a life partner who has a natural way of soothing their souls; that's the power of love for you! Laughter and music, kindness & compassion, love & beauty, nature & pets, these are all very helpful to traumatized people.

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

[QUOTE=floridaorange;1137492]What exactly does she bring to the relationship that makes up for this? Because frankly, that kind of toxicity would be enough to bring anyone down with them.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=DIDI;1137498]There most certainly are other sides and unfortunately people like you who try to understand and be there are the people that are bearing the brunt of those other sides.

I have no idea what to do about this but wish you all the luck in the world.[/QUOTE]

I don't know, nothing I guess. But it wasn't that kind of situation where I can weigh the equation and decide, fuck this. I've known her 13 years and have seen the change and know why. There's always a reason that triggers or exacerbates her condition and unfortunately this has been the worst yet. There's really nothing I can do anymore because she won't let anyone. I've reached out to her but she hasn't responded, and frankly with my dad just passing away three weeks ago, I doubt if I can deal with her.

This might be heresy given the sensitivity of depression and the general stereotype that people can't help themselves or do anything about it, all I can say is, shit I've had to deal with myself and from observing how she deals, our problems don't define us but they do reveal who we are, or can, be at our cores.

[QUOTE=KiwiTollway;1137504] @Feather, maybe your ex has undiagnosed PTSD (7.7 million people suffer from it) which makes her unable to maintain close relationships if they trigger her symptoms unknowingly. Sometimes people unknowingly have patterns of behavior that trigger symptoms of a PTSD sufferer. The reason I'm suggesting this is because you described her as sometimes inaccessible, antagonistic to being helped, at times raging with anger, etc.[/quote]

I have only read about PTSD in the context of war and soldiers but yes certainly. I know of at least seven life-changing traumas since I've known her, and two of them are medical conditions with no cure. Without going into the details, I will never wish her experiences on anyone. If I had gone through the same things I wouldn't know what kind of person I would be either. It's why I've always compromised and accommodated the negativity and nastiness. It's easier to write the person off and walk away when you've only met someone for the first time but I've seen this develope over the course of 13 years now.

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

[QUOTE=feather;1137505]There's really nothing I can do anymore because she won't let anyone. I've reached out to her but she hasn't responded, and frankly with my dad just passing away three weeks ago, I doubt if I can deal with her.[/QUOTE]

I feel for you feather. I'm in a very similar place to you - trying to work out how I can help my wife, if at all. I have experienced how the pressures of trying to 'manage' someone like that is at times impossible to deal with alongside your normal day to day life. Having your father pass away must make the situation much more difficult.

I had very little exposure to depression and mental illness before this and the snippets I'd learnt through the media were way off the mark. Needless to say, it has been a steep learning curve for me. Going through what we have together and seeing the inside of a psychiatric hospital has taught me a lot...yet still I feel like I have very little comprehension as to what is really going on. It's a difficult one to grasp.

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

[QUOTE=benda;1137510]I feel for you feather. I'm in a very similar place to you - trying to work out how I can help my wife, if at all. I have experienced how the pressures of trying to 'manage' someone like that is at times impossible to deal with alongside your normal day to day life. Having your father pass away must make the situation much more difficult.

I had very little exposure to depression and mental illness before this and the snippets I'd learnt through the media were way off the mark. Needless to say, it has been a steep learning curve for me. Going through what we have together and seeing the inside of a psychiatric hospital has taught me a lot...yet still I feel like I have very little comprehension as to what is really going on. It's a difficult one to grasp.[/QUOTE] Really sorry to read this. :(

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

[QUOTE=feather;1137505]I don't know, nothing I guess. But it wasn't that kind of situation where I can weigh the equation and decide, fuck this. I've known her 13 years and have seen the change and know why. There's always a reason that triggers or exacerbates her condition and unfortunately this has been the worst yet. There's really nothing I can do anymore because she won't let anyone. I've reached out to her but she hasn't responded, and frankly with my dad just passing away three weeks ago, I doubt if I can deal with her.

This might be heresy given the sensitivity of depression and the general stereotype that people can't help themselves or do anything about it, all I can say is, shit I've had to deal with myself and from observing how she deals, our problems don't define us but they do reveal who we are, or can, be at our cores.

I have only read about PTSD in the context of war and soldiers but yes certainly. I know of at least seven life-changing traumas since I've known her, and two of them are medical conditions with no cure. Without going into the details, I will never wish her experiences on anyone. If I had gone through the same things I wouldn't know what kind of person I would be either. It's why I've always compromised and accommodated the negativity and nastiness. It's easier to write the person off and walk away when you've only met someone for the first time but I've seen this develope over the course of 13 years now.[/QUOTE] So sorry to hear about your dad :(

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

[QUOTE=feather;1137505] It's why I've always compromised and accommodated the negativity and nastiness. It's easier to write the person off and walk away when you've only met someone for the first time but I've seen this develope over the course of 13 years now.[/QUOTE]

Hey buddy, that makes perfect sense, I get it now. wish you two the best and hopefully you two can get through these difficult times together. keep the faith bro. things will get better

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

[QUOTE=benda;1137510]I feel for you feather. I'm in a very similar place to you - trying to work out how I can help my wife, if at all. I have experienced how the pressures of trying to 'manage' someone like that is at times impossible to deal with alongside your normal day to day life. Having your father pass away must make the situation much more difficult.

I had very little exposure to depression and mental illness before this and the snippets I'd learnt through the media were way off the mark. Needless to say, it has been a steep learning curve for me. Going through what we have together and seeing the inside of a psychiatric hospital has taught me a lot...yet still I feel like I have very little comprehension as to what is really going on. It's a difficult one to grasp.[/QUOTE]

I'm sorry to hear that too ... unfortunately it is this difficulty in comprehension that makes them feel isolated, more alone, and withdraw into themselves. And from my experience they find talking about it tiring, repetitive, and frustrating because 'nobody understands'. The hard part I find is that their mental state colors everything and sometimes stuff just gets skewed, that's when it's challenging to find a common ground to work through things. Many times like this I'm just walking on eggshells and have to be extra careful because a word can be interpreted wrongly and set it all off.

But if and when they do talk it does help, I've observed the difference. In the past sometimes just being there as a physical presence in the room can help too even if they don't want to talk about it. The bottom line, I once told her, even if I can't get into her head and understand it, its effects on her are very physical and visible and all I can do is ameliorate those.

Thanks DD, FO, this has been my worst year but there's really nothing to be done, it's beyond me, just gotta ride it out.

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

[QUOTE=feather;1137546]I'm sorry to hear that too ... unfortunately it is this difficulty in comprehension that makes them feel isolated, more alone, and withdraw into themselves. And from my experience they find talking about it tiring, repetitive, and frustrating because 'nobody understands'. The hard part I find is that their mental state colors everything and sometimes stuff just gets skewed, that's when it's challenging to find a common ground to work through things. Many times like this I'm just walking on eggshells and have to be extra careful because a word can be interpreted wrongly and set it all off.

But if and when they do talk it does help, I've observed the difference. In the past sometimes just being there as a physical presence in the room can help too even if they don't want to talk about it. The bottom line, I once told her, even if I can't get into her head and understand it, its effects on her are very physical and visible and all I can do is ameliorate those.[/QUOTE]

Feather, What you wrote is really beautiful and incredibly loving towards her and I think you've really nailed it regarding the lens by which she views/hears/interprets everything, which makes things skewed for her & difficult for you to be around her. I'm glad you're not subjecting yourself to any nastiness or negativity because with your kind heart, you shouldn't have to endure that, especially in experiencing your own loss.

I'm so sorry about your Dad. You certainly have had a rough year to ride out. I hope your Mom is doing okay; I can't imagine losing my spouse like she has; I hope she has a strong support system around her. You have all of us :D. Please vent anytime you need to.

Benda, My husband has gone through what you're experiencing because of my hardships/losses/etc. and we're on the other side of it now for quite some time. Rest assured you are of great help to your wife because you are there for her. You're already doing the single most important thing.

Being present to note what/how anyone thrives or endures their life is a great privilege and loving her through it will, ultimately, bring you two even closer. I know the stress for you must be so hard at times, but hopefully she's getting the great care she needs & deserves. Post anytime you need to, there is great wisdom here when people feel free to participate.

If someone was suffering a severe kidney infection, lung infection, etc. there would be no stigma attached to being hospitalized and cared for, but because mental illness involves what we need to function (just as important as our kidneys & lungs) our brains & affects our personality & choices, there is no question it is paramount people get the medical attention they need, which sometimes includes hospitalization. This can save a life! Be their strong/constant love, that's the best you can be whatever our significant others/friends go through.

Eckhart Tolle's writing about everyone's "pain body" really resonates with me, if I've already shared that, forgive me. Here is a snippet from his book I love "The Power of Now" which isn't about mental illness or chemical imbalances, but offers another way of looking at the way people act when it seems they've become their own pain/experiences to their own detriment & those who love them.

[I]“The pain-body wants to survive, just like every other entity in existence, and it can only survive if it gets you [its host] to unconsciously identify with it. It can then rise up, take you over, “become you,” and live through you. It needs to get its “food” through you. It will feed on any experience that resonates with its own kind of energy, anything that creates further pain in whatever form: anger, destructiveness, hatred, grief, emotional drama, violence, and even illness. So the pain-body, when it has taken you over, will create a situation in your life that reflects back its own energy frequency for it to feed on. Pain can only feed on pain. Pain cannot feed on joy. It finds it quite indigestible." -- [/I]Eckhart Tolle

[URL]http://www.personal-development-inside-out.com/eckhart-tolle.html[/URL]

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

[IMG]http://www.mercuryserver.com/forums/images/misc/quote_icon.png[/IMG] Originally Posted by [B]DIDI[/B] [URL="http://www.mercuryserver.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1137385#post1137385"][IMG]http://www.mercuryserver.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png[/IMG][/URL]

             Btw that quote of Robin's you are using as a sig is a symptom of his illness not a truth.

                  [QUOTE=floridaorange;1137460]"I can't believe I'm saying this", but I agree with Didi, on this ^ one.[/QUOTE]

Actually, it's a quote from a line for his character in the movie [I]World's Greatest Dad [/I][2009], which I watched last night so that's how I know, whose son committed suicide due to asphyxia [B]in the movie.[/B] It's a line in the concluding scenes of a movie about depression, still applicable nonetheless as a conclusion/truth a person believes to be true, or at least the screenplay writer did anyway & I agreed.

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

^^^So that probably makes it the symptom of the illness of a character written by a screenwriter in a film . :lol: Really should have watched the film before giving Robin the credit. :lol:

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

[QUOTE=DIDI;1138015]^^^So that probably makes it the symptom of the illness of a character written by a screenwriter in a film . :lol: Really should have watched the film before giving Robin the credit. :lol:[/QUOTE]

Does it really matter? It's how many people actually feel.

People attribute quotes to celebrities all the time to something they said in a film, but I think they should name the film as well. I wouldn't recommend that film (he's good in it, of course); it is incredibly eery how it paralleled what happened. He also says in the film looking straight into the camera "Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem, there is help...." and at the end of the film, he dives into a pool after confessing that he lied to everyone he knew, appearing very relieved, happy & free (which is contrary to his character in it)... it's pretty emotional. And he played that part 5 years ago. :(

Watching him on The Actor's Studio right now.

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

Well it matters enough to you that you keep bringing it up again and again. Why are you dwelling on a tiny post I made days ago?? So a couple of people on the internet disagree with you ?? It happens. In fact it happens irl as well. It usually isn't personal and even when it is it can only harm you if you don't get that. For your own sake you have to learn when enough is enough.

He played that part all his life. Robins Williams was in emotional strife for most , or perhaps all, his working life. He probably chose roles like that.

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

The life of an addict oppressed by manic depression is not what many make it to be, that's your romanticized idea. It's all messy, even sordid. That's why you like to remember a dead celebrity by his movie quotes and not by his somewhat wretched life.

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

^^ You said that so much better than I could.

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

I'm just sayin', of course, not a comment on Kiwi's post.

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

^^^ It was just really well said. :) It was something for all of us.

Now something that Robin Williams probably would have liked. Australian comedian :)

[video=youtube;60ETdhgLA8U]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60ETdhgLA8U[/video]

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

Didi and Kiwi - your childish bickering is depressing all of us. :lol:

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

Group hug :Respect:

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

[QUOTE=floridaorange;1138090]Didi and Kiwi - your childish bickering is depressing all of us. :lol:[/QUOTE] It's that relevance thing with you again isn't it.;)

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

[QUOTE=DIDI;1138212]It's that relevance thing with you again isn't it.;)[/QUOTE]

No. I'm mostly here for the lulz and the occasional thugfucker mix ;). I also dig the international component. But I don't seek relevance from a MB, that would be depressing :lol:.

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

^Comprende?

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

hi guys, just came across this video. I think it's very good and some of you might feel related to, specially the role genetics have in depression.

[video=youtube;GOK1tKFFIQI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOK1tKFFIQI[/video]

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

Yah.. If you have the depressed genes and your parents were assholes, and you suffered difficult live events (who hasnt?) and you are under stress, and your circadian rhythm is off.... well good luck! But being aware of these things and the role they play is a start imho. It is possible to change and feel better... you just probably need a fair amount of professional help to develop a life program that is designed around you feeling better and getting better. Not saying it's possible for everyone, but it was for me.

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

[video=youtube;Qee6zug4ouw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qee6zug4ouw&list=UUZ8Sxmkweh65HetaZfR8YuA[/video]

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

^ what a beautiful video! Glenn Close is amazing, but how she loves her sister is so visual and apparent, very moving. They are very "close." lol People are not their disease, true. Also, people are not their behavior. They may behave as "assholes" at times or often, but are not assholes. No one IS their behavior. People are really only themselves when they are loving, otherwise, they are projecting an act, their illness, their state of mind, their unresolved issues, unmet needs, their depression, their coping, their ego, etc. through their physical being. imho

The science video is also a good one, thanks for posting that Krystyan. There is brain therapy for the hippocampus that doesn't involve medication or electrical stimulation or anything like that, it involves the eyes & ears using colors, lights, and sounds & is pretty new & offers incredible results. The rest of the terms used, I have to educate myself on. Will look those up. thanks!

wow, FL... tell us how you really feel. :lol:

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

I didn't know that ketamine was being considered as an experimental treatment for depression..

[url="http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/turn-on-tune-in-get-better-psychedelic-drugs-hold-medical-promise/"]Turn On, Tune In, Get Better: Psychedelic Drugs Hold Medical Promise - Scientific American[/url]

[IMG]http://www.scientificamerican.com/sciam/cache/file/C136BEBB-41E0-49CC-BE315706E7B1C040.jpg[/IMG]

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

^the other 3 you've had success with I take it? :)

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

oxytocin:

[URL="http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/07/130722123206.htm"]http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/07/130722123206.htm

[url]http://ucsdnews.ucsd.edu/pressrelease/could_love_hormone_help_treat_depression/[/url]

[/URL]

Re: The reality of depression - Decoded Magazine

[QUOTE=floridaorange;1141219]^the other 3 you've had success with I take it? :)[/QUOTE]

Yeah I am still not convinced that any of them would work for everybody.. in fact, sometimes I feel like it could go the other way depending on the person.. but obviously there is more success than not : )

Watching this last night.. I had no idea he went trough all that

[video=youtube;3eAe3ZKTW2s]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eAe3ZKTW2s[/video]