This seems symbolic, stupid and dangerous. I'd prefer to have captured terrorists off U.S. soil. I'm ok with closing Gitmo, but there needs to be a safer place to house the terrorist than the middle of the U.S. Could you imagine if some of the terrorists escaped or were broken out of prison and were loose in this country? It seems as stupid as bringing KSM close to the scene of the crime to be tried.

[url]http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/11/16/thirst-jobs-drives-cities-beg-feds-guantanamo-detainees/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%253A+foxnews%252Flatest+%2528FOXNews.com+-+Latest+Headlines%2529[/url]

Re: Gitmo possibly moving to Illinois

I agree... I don't like the looks of this deal. I wonder who's getting kickbacks to be pushing so hard to get these guys within 2 hours of one of the largest US cities. Did we run out of space in rural Montana?

Re: Gitmo possibly moving to Illinois

To say nothing of the hotbed of radicalism that will emerge when these Jihadists are interspersed with the general prison population.

That change too many of you voted for is looking pretty dire.

Re:

[QUOTE=superdave;807167]Could you imagine if some of the terrorists escaped or were broken out of prison and were loose in this country?[/QUOTE]

Just imagine all of the terroist cells that are already in the U.S.? I watched a news special not so long ago about this very subject. Apparently, the current main pipeline for terrorists to enter the States is through Mexico.

Re:

[QUOTE=Miroslav;807186]I wonder who's getting kickbacks to be pushing so hard to get these guys within 2 hours of one of the largest US cities.[/QUOTE]

The Illinois factor is not too difficult to figure out. Hmmm...who in a very high political position has close ties to the state of Illinois?

[IMG]http://i34.tinypic.com/wk13p.jpg[/IMG]

"Survey Says?...."

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[QUOTE=Michael^Heaven;807213]The Illinois factor is not too difficult to figure out. Hmmm...who in a very high political position has close ties to the state of Illinois?

[IMG]http://i34.tinypic.com/wk13p.jpg[/IMG]

"Survey Says?...."[/QUOTE]

Coincidence - I think not.

Re: Gitmo possibly moving to Illinois

It always strikes me as ironic when people that trumpet the loudest about how everything about America is the best in the world and second to none have a problem with using the American Justice system to prosecute and house prisoners.

I've actually spent a fair amount of time at a maximum security facility in Illinois, and I have to tell you, it's hell on earth and secure as fuck, and this facility would be even more secure than that one. I've got no reservations at all about sending anyone there. No one has ever escaped from a federal supermax prison, and this facility will be upgraded to that level, per my understanding.

You. Are. Never. Going. To. See. These. Guys. Again.

Period.

Here's a further reality check -- these guys are not going to be in contact with the general population, with each other, or anyone else for that matter. They just aren't. Most likely, they'll be in solitary confinement for 22-23 hours of the day, will eat in their cells, and might see an hour a day of sunlight in an individual outdoor cell. They will not be allowed to commune with other prisoners, period. That was the day-to-day life of a guy I was appointed to represent, and he didn't conspire to murder 3000 Americans. If you're concerned that they will indoctrinate the other prisoners, you need to come up with a new concern, because that one is factually unfounded.

Re: Gitmo possibly moving to Illinois

idunno, i guess they think this is the right choice for some reason?

my concern is not a question of safety and security, but one of emitting a certain type of energy, and subtle vibrations - if that means anything to the uninitiated. 2 hours outside of chi-town (?).

zoning for this super-fortress is a bit sketchy though. shit reminds me of taft, and how prisons are built to bring in a swell of industry and modern day slavery. obviously, prisons are an abysmal bomb drop on land value - with a shock zone of a far reaching proximity.

oh well, they gotta do what they think is right.

Re: Gitmo possibly moving to Illinois

[QUOTE=i!!ustrious;807305] my concern is not a question of safety and security, but one of emitting a certain type of energy, and subtle vibrations - if that means anything to the uninitiated. .[/QUOTE]

Not following this. What do you mean by "emitting a certain type of energy?" I assume you're speaking figuratively, but can you spell out what you mean? Assume I must be part of the uninitiated. :oops:;)

[QUOTE=i!!ustrious;807305] obviously, prisons are an abysmal bomb drop on land value - with a shock zone of a far reaching proximity. [/QUOTE]

It is a drain on property value in one sense, but they don't drop prisons in the middle of booming, burgeoning cities anyway, and the reality is that a lot of small, struggling communities compete for this type of opportunity because of the jobs it can create. Probably a net positive, in the big picture.

Re: Gitmo possibly moving to Illinois

One other thing -- [URL="http://maps.google.com/maps?q=thomson,+il&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-a&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Thomson,+Carroll,+Illinois&gl=us&ei=GAMDS7z6J4nfnAf5vaVl&ved=0CAkQ8gEwAA&ll=41.95132,-90.604248&spn=5.424937,9.788818&t=h&z=7&iwloc=A"]look up Thomson, Illinois on Google Maps[/URL]. It is not as if these guys could just hop on the El and be in downtown Chicago in 20 minutes in the extremely unlikely event they were to escape. It's not even particularly close to an Interstate. Might I also add that I don't think these guys are going to blend in rural Illinois -- and if they were to escape, they'd be only slightly less fucked than they would be under lock and key in prison.

Let's try to be realistic and keep this in perspective.

Re: Gitmo possibly moving to Illinois

that can be interpreted as figuratively, yes. pardon me for using the word "uninitiated" -- that's quite ambiguous lol. i guess the word "aware" might be a better fit.

with regards to that term i used, i'd like to give an example:

whether dwelling near mass killings, war, or slaughterhouses, one inevitably picks up on the "pollution" blighting the atmosphere, and subtle worlds. does not wack shit impel people to lower actions? this is all very subjective indeed, but then again, we never are quite exactly aware of the causes of the effects that happen all around us.

try to carry out a psychological exercise close to a slaughterhouse, and you might receive signals of acute madness, not to mention the entities which attach themselves to the spilled blood.

now i'm not one to know of the full spectrum of horrific shit that goes down in a prison, but i can postulate that it might have an effect on the other inmates, enforcement, and the surrounding vicinity.

i see the economic benefit of installing a prison in a rural town, but imho, i think it's a very shady buisness.

Re: Gitmo possibly moving to Illinois

the president of the board of education for chicago public schools just shot himself in the head - and that was just the illinois school system!

Re: Gitmo possibly moving to Illinois

[QUOTE=toasty;807283] Here's a further reality check -- these guys are not going to be in contact with the general population, with each other, or anyone else for that matter. They just aren't. Most likely, they'll be in solitary confinement for 22-23 hours of the day, will eat in their cells, and might see an hour a day of sunlight in an individual outdoor cell. They will not be allowed to commune with other prisoners, period. That was the day-to-day life of a guy I was appointed to represent, and he didn't conspire to murder 3000 Americans. If you're concerned that they will indoctrinate the other prisoners, you need to come up with a new concern, because that one is factually unfounded.[/QUOTE]

Seems like a harsh way to keep someone who hasn't been convicted of anything. Is there any point in closing Guantanamo down if you are just going to move them somewhere else.

Re: Gitmo possibly moving to Illinois

CLOSE GITMO, CLOSE GITMO!!! whoa wait, they're bringing the prisoner's where?

typical NIMBYs. :roll:

Re: Gitmo possibly moving to Illinois

[QUOTE=chunky;807407]Seems like a harsh way to keep someone who hasn't been convicted of anything. Is there any point in closing Guantanamo down if you are just going to move them somewhere else.[/QUOTE]

Oh, I'm totally in favor of trying them swiftly, and think they should have been tried eons ago. You can't just hold someone indefinitely without charging them with something.

I was assuming we were talking about post-conviction detention (although, realistically, they [B]are [/B]going to spend some time under those conditions pre-conviction as well). Frankly though, if I were them, I'd probably prefer to be in seg than in the general population of a federal supermax prison, where they'd likely be forcibly sodomized on an hourly basis.

Re: Gitmo possibly moving to Illinois

[QUOTE=toasty;807429]Oh, I'm totally in favor of trying them swiftly, and think they should have been tried eons ago. You can't just hold someone indefinitely without charging them with something.
[/QUOTE]

^^^Exactly.

Can you imagine the outcry if a member of the american forces or public was held indefeitley without charge without representation etc etc in another country.

Re: Gitmo possibly moving to Illinois

apparently you guys didn't get the memo.. The US can do whatever they want remember?

Re: Gitmo possibly moving to Illinois

[QUOTE=superdave;807167]This seems symbolic, stupid and dangerous. I'd prefer to have captured terrorists off U.S. soil. I'm ok with closing Gitmo, but there needs to be a safer place to house the terrorist than the middle of the U.S. Could you imagine if some of the terrorists escaped or were broken out of prison and were loose in this country? It seems as stupid as bringing KSM close to the scene of the crime to be tried.

[URL]http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/11/16/thirst-jobs-drives-cities-beg-feds-guantanamo-detainees/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%253A+foxnews%252Flatest+%2528FOXNews.com+-+Latest+Headlines%2529[/URL][/QUOTE]

the location of the link you are referring to says it all

Re: Gitmo possibly moving to Illinois

^lol

Upon further consideration...honestly, it doesn't matter where you keep these bums. Jenks and Toasty have a point. Might as well take them there...plenty of people in prisons all over the country with people who probably pose more of a threat to you and me. And we're already a target for terrorists anyways no matter where they are.

Re: Gitmo possibly moving to Illinois

The loony liberals in Amherst, MA were previously trying to pass recommendations to get some of the released to be housed in Western MA.

Let's dump some more idiots around here :lol:

Gitmo possibly moving to Illinois

Like most everything about Gitmo, things are hidden or ignored, and when brought to the light of day it is a very ugly picture we see. None of what is in that report makes any sense whatever. Gitmo seems to be coverup city, but exactly what is being covered up? And yet some will still believe that all those there are guilty without any trial when it has been shown how most were captured for bounty money. And they believe that life is comfortable a vacation at Gitmo, when no fact supports that either.

I think when we learn what is going on/has gone on at Gitmo, it will be horrific. And just goes to show how Gitmo needs to be closed.