[i]"The U.S. Central Intelligence Agency is holding top al Qaeda suspects in a secret Jordanian jail where they are subjected to interrogation methods banned in the United States, an Israeli newspaper said on Wednesday"[/i]

[i]"U.S. interrogators are known to threaten some detainees with shipping them off to Jordan if they don't cooperate," Scarborough said. "Like other Middle Eastern countries, Jordan uses physical means to coerce confessions and vital intelligence information."[/i]

i personally don't have a problem with this.

detain them illegally, torture them, kill them for all i care, as long as i can sit comfortably in my lazy boy and drink budweiser and watch baseball without worrying about a plane flying into my house.

thoughts?

Re: CIA seceretly holding Qaeda suspects

[quote=EvenSteven";p="65430] thoughts? [/quote]

I think it is mindsets like this that has resulted in America having the worst reputation in the world that they have had in my lifetime.

I have no problem with aggressive interrogation tactics, and I would also note that because these folks are not American citizens, I am not even all that concerned about being detained indefinitely, without representation, etc.

But torture? We should not torture people, regardless of whether we're bound by the Geneva Convention, because we are part of a civilized society and should not drop to that level. Torture is for savages. We have to remain above such things to maintain any credibility in the world.

The abuse of prisoners at Abu Grhaib (sp?) is, in my opinion, largely responsible for the growing insurgency in Iraq. There are a lot more people over there that want to kill us now than there were before that happened. It will take generations for us to repair the damage that was done there...

What if by torturing a Qaeda terrorist, we found the location of Osama Bin Laden, or the location of the next attact and prevented it, or the location of hostages about to be beheaded?

i then say, torture the fuckers if we know they are in fact the bad guys.

i'm not talking about prisoners, i'm talking about high ranking Qaeda officials.

meanwhile, this budweiser is great!

^^ it would appear that we have, in fact, been torturing prisoners for years and we haven't caught OBL yet, so I'm not sure that you could necessarily equate the two even if we do catch him.

[quote=";p="65608] i then say, torture the fuckers if we know they are in fact the bad guys.
[/quote]

This is reminiscent of the Salem witch trials. How do we know that they are, in fact, the bad guys before beginning the torture?

[quote=";p="65608] i'm not talking about prisoners, i'm talking about high ranking Qaeda officials. [/quote]

That's a precarious line to try to draw. I wouldn't want to be the one to determine who gets tortured and who doesn't...

[quote=";p="65608] meanwhile, this budweiser is great! [/quote]

On this point, we agree! :Cheerz:

Who is to say that this is even true? Why do people insist on believing everything they read on the internet?

Re: CIA seceretly holding Qaeda suspects

The Salem Witch trials, :lol: man that was some messed up stuff wasn't it? Those Puritans were a wild and crazy bunch. Can't really blame England for kicking them out.

How's this for a philosophy,

Puritans - "We think you're a witch, and we're going to kill you."

Witch - "I'm not a witch!! I'm not a witch!!"

Puritans - "Okay, we have a test for this to see if you are, this will solve the problem. We're going to dunk you in water. If you are indeed a Witch you will survive with your powers and you will be guilty and we will kill you. If you drown and die like a human, turns out you weren't a Witch. You win. Okay?"

Hey, good idea fellas! :?

And to think we've come so far since then. :roll:

Re: CIA seceretly holding Qaeda suspects

It's hypocritical to let another country do your dirty work. Can't people in America, my country, get real with what we're doing and what's going on around the world?

I say torture them as much as necessary if it's possible to get any information that could prevent a terrorist attack. Torture for fun isn't acceptable however.

It's like two sets of rules for enemies in America vs Terrorists

While America worries about people finding out we may let someone in custody possibly be tortured, the terrorists are beheading someone on TV again this week.

And in Iraq, the insurgents or patriots depending on your view hide in mosques from American soldiers because we can't shoot because we're afraid we'll upset Muslims if their mosques are harmed.

And people wonder why things are fucked up?

i think americans should be tortured. god what a fucking stupid country.

Re: CIA seceretly holding Qaeda suspects

Here's the deal people... there are international laws that countries need to stick to. If you don't then nobody else will.

If you launch a pre-emptive strike on Iraq then North Korea or Iran can do exactly the same to you.

If you illegally torture prisoners then they will do the same...

Get it? The rest of the world understands. :|

yeah, those puritans wore silly shoes.

Re: CIA seceretly holding Qaeda suspects

The firs thing to stop terrorism is not torturing a terroris ?cause in replay will kill more people , torture in clandestinity allways exist other thing is what they tell you , who things they don?t torture people in Wantanamo? or you thing is just a jail?

[quote=discojoe";p="65916]i think americans should be tortured. god what a fucking stupid country.[/quote]

Stupid twat.

And I hope that Canada will someday experience a "9/11" for themselves. Even though you have nothing of value that could be knocked down in the first place. :Bingo:

[quote=Civic_Zen";p="66287] And I hope that Canada will someday experience a "9/11" for themselves. Even though you have nothing of value that could be knocked down in the first place. :Bingo:[/quote]

Hehehe, a direct hit for Civic, BUT...as for Canadians experiencing something like 9/11: they don't have Bush. Sorry.

9/11 didn't happen because of Bush you moron.

[quote=";p="66324] 9/11 didn't happen because of Bush you moron. [/quote]

9/11 happened because of your own foreign policy. Whether you want to admit it or not. Theres reason those people hate you enough to strap bombs to their chests and fly planes into buildings. You just havnt bothered to research it.

You invade a country for oil, we send peacekeepers to try and keep the peace. You train, support and empower dozens of dictators around the world over the past 30 years, resulting in hundreds and hundreds of thousands of lives lost to assassinations, deprivation and genocide and now you are paying for it. You are living in fear because of what you have done. Sorry man what comes around goes around.

I dont hate americans. I shouldnt have said that. But i just cant believe some of the things you say. Some american tells me the other day here in chile the world doesnt understand bush and the american election because they dont get the same information he does, then tells me his starting homepage is fox news. I just walked away and shook my head.

Re: CIA seceretly holding Qaeda suspects

Discojoe, you definitely seem like you hate America. You called us all stupid and all should be tortured. You called a country of over 260 million people stupid and should be tortured in this thread.

Plus, you talk about anti-American sentiment. You certainly aren't helping things by making such comments. If anything, Americans including me should hate you for posting such hate like this.

Re: CIA seceretly holding Qaeda suspects

The only solution to stopping terrorism and a repeat of 9/11 begins with a long term foreign policy plan, in which America works as a fully compliant member of the UN and international community. Sadly I don't see this happening at the moment.

[quote=Jenks";p="66324]9/11 didn't happen because of Bush you moron.[/quote]

I still think it did :Tongue:

But seriously...peepz flaming Discojoe for being hating on Americans: he did apologize, and now it's up to you to do some introspection. Stop blaming the rest of the world, start looking for the faults in yourself.

If any American would tell me that the world doesn't understand Bush and the elections because we don't get the same information, I'd not just be shaking my head and walking away. I'd fucking laugh myself to death about such stupidity, sorry guys. But hey, I don't hate Americans, most of you should know that by now. :LoveYou:

And Jenks, I think it would've happened regardless of the president in office. Last Week I met an American guy studying at my university, he told me he doesn't want to go back to the States, but he did get his absentee ballot. And I met this gorgeous Canadian girl...dammit. Going off topic too much now, hehhe.

[quote=Yao";p="67375]But seriously...peepz flaming Discojoe for being hating on Americans:[/quote] He's getting flammed for being a moron and making such widesweeping statements about Americans. Seperate the people from the government you dickhead. French govt are a waste of oxygen imo, but i have no beef with the citizens of France. get it?

[quote] And Jenks, I think it would've happened regardless of the president in office. Last Week I met an American guy studying at my university, he told me he doesn't want to go back to the States, but he did get his absentee ballot. And I met this gorgeous Canadian girl...dammit. Going off topic too much now, hehhe.[/quote]

you are correct, it would have happened whoever was in office. That event was years in planning, and didn't happen because of Bush. Saying 911 was Bush's fault makes you an idiot Discojoe, and anyone else who thinks the same.

As for the American who doesn't want to come back. Good. Bye.

I'd live in Europe if i could (not for political reasons,) but America is always my home.

As for the Canadian girl you met, cheers man, hope all goes well.