or lawers ?

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

does it deal with Scottish law?

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

european

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

if it US law, toasty , rubyraks, are lawyers and i have a solid grasp of certain law (agency, estate, wills, real estate, civil liability) but i am not a lawyer, i just deal with those topics often and have gained some experience of the ideas.

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

they have laws up there?? :shock:

red what u done now??? :Who:

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

ah ok, maybe i asked on the wrong board but it was worth a shot anyway, thanks

p.s. i,m not in trouble lol

yet

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[quote=Dhar_2;627338]they have laws up there?? :shock:

red what u done now??? :Who:[/quote]

aint done nothing, it was regarding something somewhere :|

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

give me another year or so, and you'll have three on the board.

(i'm wondering if i can search european law in lexis or westlaw...hmmm)

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

not in the one you use, but they do offer versions holding international law. we use the version for canadian tax law.(not me, but my firm)

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

I actually took some courses at U of Paris and Cambridge on various topics, so if you're just curious about something generally, I might be able to offer some very broad thoughts with the caveat that it was a long time ago and I'd be offering thoughts, not advice. If you intend to actually act on this or have an honest-to-goodness legal issue that you need to have resolved as opposed to just wondering about something, though, you should really talk to someone local to your area.

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

i have a cursory understanding of law, just enough to provide witty, albiet mostly useless, insights.

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[quote=toasty;627358]I actually took some courses at U of Paris and Cambridge on various topics, so if you're just curious about something generally, I might be able to of fer some very broad tho ughts with the caveat that it was a long time ago and I'd be offering thoughts, not advice. If you intend to actually act on this or have an honest-to-goodness legal issue that you need to have resolved as opposed to just wondering about something, though, you should really talk to someone local to your area.[/quote]

right if u were contracted to do a work for a company i.e. normally employed and law stated you could only work 40 hours in a week but this company wanted you to sign a get out clause so you could work more than 40 hours a week before you got the job in the first place and you didnt do more than 40 hours when they asked you can they terminate your contract even if law stated you couldnt do more than 40 hours ?

and how does body lanuage stand in court? LOL

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[quote=red1;627383] and how does body lanuage stand in court? LOL[/quote]

dress nice. be civil and respectful. body language means a lot in court.

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[quote=Garrick;627403]dress nice. be civil and respectful. body language means a lot in court.[/quote]

what about mind tricks? :lol:

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

i haven't looked anything up, but reading what you posted above, I don't believe you can simply waive the law. However, being that you never worked over 40 hours, the law was not broken.

no offense, but what kind of pansy-ass government doesn't let you work more than 40 hours a week???

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

apparently its european legislation, i might be wrong tbh i,m not 100% sure but when i entered a job i was given a get out clause to sign saying i was allowed to work more than law sudjested

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[QUOTE=red1;627383]right if u were contracted to do a work for a company i.e. normally employed and law stated you could only work 40 hours in a week but this company wanted you to sign a get out clause so you could work more than 40 hours a week before you got the job in the first place and you didnt do more than 40 hours when they asked you can they terminate your contract even if law stated you couldnt do more than 40 hours ?

and how does body lanuage stand in court? LOL[/QUOTE]

OK, tell me if I've got this right, because I'm a little confused on the chronology:

1. You're interested in a job, and they're interested in you
2. As a condition to you working, they want you to sign some sort of waiver where you agree to work more than 40 hours/week, which is evidently not allowed by law.
3. You decline
4. You don't do any work for them.

Even if they're doing something wrong, it doesn't follow that you personally have any rights against them unless you gave something up in reliance upon some sort of legitimate expectation that you were going to be employed by them in which case you might have something to bitch about. You don't have any right to work for any particular company in the US, and I can't imagine that's going to be any different in whatever country we're talking about.

On the other hand, if the law says that you can't be asked to work more than 40 hours/week and they want to ask employees to do just that, there might be some regulatory agency (like our Department of Labor) that might have something to say about it. As an aside, though, I find it pretty hard to believe that there are no Europeans working more than 40 hours/week, which leads me to believe there is some legitimate way around that. Sounds like a statute or regulation to me, though, and any thoughts I'd have on that would be a pure guess, which you don't want. Can't interpret a statute I haven't seen.

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[quote=88Mariner;627410] no offense, but what kind of pansy-ass government doesn't let you work more than 40 hours a week???[/quote]

socialism (pretty much where US is headed)

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[quote=toasty;627468]OK, tell me if I've got this right, because I'm a little confused on the chronology:

1. You're interested in a job, and they're interested in you
2. As a condition to you working, they want you to sign some sort of waiver where you agree to work more than 40 hours/week, which is evidently not allowed by law.
3. You decline
4. You don't do any work for them.

Even if they're doing something wrong, it doesn't follow that you personally have any rights against them unless you gave something up in reliance upon some sort of legitimate expectation that you were going to be employed by them in which case you might have something to bitch about. You don't have any right to work for any particular company in the US, and I can't imagine that's going to be any different in whatever country we're talking about.

On the other hand, if the law says that you can't be asked to work more than 40 hours/week and they want to ask employees to do just that, there might be some regulatory agency (like our Department of Labor) that might have something to say about it. As an aside, though, I find it pretty hard to believe that there are no Europeans working more than 40 hours/week, which leads me to believe there is some legitimate way around that. Sounds like a statute or regulation to me, though, and any thoughts I'd have on that would be a pure guess, which you don't want. Can't interpret a statute I haven't seen.[/quote]

thanks toasty...the thing u sign when you get the job ( or is part of getting the job ) is actually giving your consent to working over the maximum aloud time which i understand but if you then chose not to work over that amount of time for whatever reasons where does that leave me if they are not happy with it ?

can they sack me for this alone ?

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

i would think that as long as it is reasonable, you would be in breach of contract.

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[QUOTE=red1;627490]thanks toasty...the thing u sign when you get the job ( or is part of getting the job ) is actually giving your consent to working over the maximum aloud time which i understand but if you then chose not to work over that amount of time for whatever reasons where does that leave me if they are not happy with it ?

can they sack me for this alone ?[/QUOTE]

I'm still confused. Did you actually take the job and then decline to work more than 40 hours, or did you decline to sign the form when you found out about the 40 hour thing?

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[QUOTE=thesightless;627497]i would think that as long as it is reasonable, you would be in breach of contract.[/QUOTE]

Not if the contract is for him to do something illegal, he wouldn't be. Contract would be void ab initio as against public policy. At least over here, it would be.

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

I'm taking it that this is about your current job. There are probably provisions to waive within the law. But there are probably ways you can get around that as well . Say for instance if there was a danger to your health;).

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[quote=toasty;627499]Not if the contract is for him to do something illegal, he wouldn't be. Contract would be void ab initio as against public policy. At least over here, it would be.[/quote]

its not illegal because i have signed the get out clause to work more than the current stated hours but does signing this meen i have to work what they tell me i have to work :?:

what i,m trying to say is...if they wanted me to work 24/7 for 47 weeks in a year could they tell me to do this or i would loose my job ? 24/7 is a bit extreeme but u know where i,m coming from now :?:

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[IMG]http://edugol.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/dredd.jpg[/IMG]

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[QUOTE=red1;627661]its not illegal because i have signed the get out clause to work more than the current stated hours but does signing this meen i have to work what they tell me i have to work :?:

what i,m trying to say is...if they wanted me to work 24/7 for 47 weeks in a year could they tell me to do this or i would loose my job ? 24/7 is a bit extreeme but u know where i,m coming from now :?:[/QUOTE]

OK, I'm officially more confused now than I was when this thread started. Here's how it breaks down:

If you signed a contract, the terms of the contract control unless you are contracting to do something that is expressly prohibited by the law or give up a non-waivable protection that has been provided for your benefit.

If you didn't sign a contract and therefore don't have a job, you probably don't have much basis to complain.

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

red1 in confusing shocker!!

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[quote=toasty;627823]OK, I'm officially more confused now than I was when this thread started. Here's how it breaks down:

If you signed a contract, the terms of the contract control unless you are contracting to do something that is expressly prohibited by the law or give up a non-waivable protection that has been provided for your benefit.

If you didn't sign a contract and therefore don't have a job, you probably don't have much basis to complain.[/quote]

nothing confusing about it... u get a job 9 to 5 the contract signed but in the interveiw you are told u will have to sign a seperate "thing" which gives them your permission to work more than the stated law allows you to. if u dont choose to sign that obviously the probibility of u getting the job is less and seing as ur ihe hunt for a new job u want to say yes and seem keen. after a period of time you work your ass off doing all the amount of overtime you can muster after a while u start to become ill and can no longer do the overtime asked...can they terminate your contract? where does this leave me standing ?

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[quote=Jenks;627851]red1 in confusing shocker!![/quote]

something new everyday jenks ;)

:lol:

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[QUOTE=red1;627880]where does this leave me standing ?[/QUOTE]

If there are contracts that have actually been signed and work has been performed, I'd have to see the contracts to have any sort of meaningful input on it at all. Anything I could say without seeing the contracts would be completely bald speculation on my part.

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

in plain english......

jim, it is an opt out clause for the liability of the employer in regarsd to the labor laws. i.e. how wait staff here in US get below min wage and how ER nurses work more than thier non ER co-members.

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[QUOTE=thesightless;627950]in plain english......

jim, it is an opt out clause for the liability of the employer in regarsd to the labor laws. i.e. how wait staff here in US get below min wage and how ER nurses work more than thier non ER co-members.[/QUOTE]

I grasp that, but I don't even know what country we're talking about, what law the clause seeks to sidestep, or whether the law in this mystery European country allows employees to waive that provision of the law. I mean, those exculpatory clauses that we all routinely sign often aren't worth the paper they're printed on, but companies do it anyway in the hopes that it will keep the uninformed from suing them in the first place. The fact that they asked him to sign a contract doesn't mean shit. For all I know, this could be some unsophisticated mom-and-pop operation that doesn't even realize that it might not be able to do this.

And by the way, at least in MO, wait staff are not exempt from the minimum wage requirements, and the employer has to make up any shortfall if reported tips don't get them to that threshold, it's just not normally an issue. They don't "opt out" of anything. Was just looking at this recently.

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

i'd still go with the judge dredd option!

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

If you have become ill and working those hours has contributed to it, they shouldn't be able to terminate your contract. I think you need to get something in writing from a friendly doctor. Do you have either a union or a citizens advice bureau to talk to.? Do something fairly quickly to protect yourself.

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[quote=red1;625884]its about me being arms length away from being the next...

[IMG]http://www.prophetofdoom.net/pics/Islam_in_Action_Virginia_Tech_Mass_Murder_Cho_Seung-Hui/Islam_in_Action_Virginia_Tech_Mass_Murder_Cho_Seung-Hui_m.jpg[/IMG][/quote]

this option is looking more and more promising!!!

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[quote=Dhar_2;628062]this option is looking more and more promising!!![/quote]

lmao :twisted:

DONT EVEN THINK ABOUT TEMPTING ME ;)

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[QUOTE=red1;627490]thanks toasty...the thing u sign when you get the job ( or is part of getting the job ) is actually giving your consent to working over the maximum aloud time which i understand but if you then chose not to work over that amount of time for whatever reasons where does that leave me if they are not happy with it ?

can they sack me for this alone ?[/QUOTE]

Am guessing the 'opt out' your referring to is the European working time directive?

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

i want franc'es 35 hour work week. what an idea.

Re: anyone know any law minded people here

[quote=klined;628322]Am guessing the 'opt out' your referring to is the European working time directive?[/quote]

I dont know the full details of what its called but i think its something like that