JD's recent positive promotion of @Live may explain why some of his radio shows have been hit and miss (although, thankfully a lot more "hit" lately). He's a really nice all round good guy, but what he should really have said is "it makes doing my radio shows piss easy - I can decamp at the airport bar, find some really annoying (usually German) tracks that would never have made my sets in my progressive hey-day, plonk them all together with the minimum of effort and then edit it down to make way for the really annoying Kiss100 Condom/safe-sex/drug awareness adds .... oh and if those minimal/elecro-tinged/german tracks are really shite (well hey, Bedrock has been scaled down, and doesn't release that much quality stuff these days) I can re-edit them so they don't sound quite as bad ! Oh and keep it quiet, but I'm pretty glad Sasha uses Live ... he's gone down hill since 1997-2004, making me "numero uno, top of the world baby" - Fuckin-A for Ableton !"
[ms] · Est. May 2002
Music madethis place,we just kept itgoing...
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What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
52 durable postsStarted 2007-03-10Latest 2007-03-31
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
[quote=simonr;459300]JD's recent positive promotion of @Live may explain why some of his radio shows have been hit and miss (although, thankfully a lot more "hit" lately). He's a really nice all round good guy, but what he should really have said is "it makes doing my radio shows piss easy - I can decamp at the airport bar, find some really annoying (usually German) tracks that would never have made my sets in my progressive hey-day, plonk them all together with the minimum of effort and then edit it down to make way for the really annoying Kiss100 Condom/safe-sex/drug awareness adds .... oh and if those minimal/elecro-tinged/german tracks are really shite (well hey, Bedrock has been scaled down, and doesn't release that much quality stuff these days) I can re-edit them so they don't sound quite as bad ! Oh and keep it quiet, but I'm pretty glad Sasha uses Live ... he's gone down hill since 1997-2004, making me "numero uno, top of the world baby" - Fuckin-A for Ableton !"[/quote]
:lol:
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
It doesn't take much effort for Digweed to use cdj's or vinyl, so I don't think Ableton makes his life that much easier.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
What I don?t get is what does using Ableton have to do with the tracks he?s playing.:NotMe:
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
things change, u just have to live with it;)
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
^^^^Yes
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
:Laugh:
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
My comments are very tongue-in-cheek and playful: playing out live, Digger's been bang on the money the last 3 times I've caught him (Ibiza Pacha 05 & Space 06 plus Circus_Liverpool a couple of weeks back) - this has been reflected in the awesome 2 and a bit hours of his Space set (that I specifically flew for last year and had the priveledge to see), and the recent Mumbai set. For some reason the quality productions JD plays out live seldom (if ever) hit his weekly Transitions show - which is fine, IF the music that replaces them is great (remember - JD has more access to new productions that most of the planet). Last weeks 1st hour was pretty darned good (if you discount the 1st track - the Gerber and Slacker were corkers and formed the body of his recently raved about Plattenger mix), the 30-mins of his 2nd shared hour were, frankly, shabby. I'd been playing the Beirut Forum set when I read the Ableton interview and a few thoughts sprang into my head that I thought I'd share with the [ms] crew.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
[quote=simonr;459392]My comments are very tongue-in-cheek and playful: playing out live, Digger's been bang on the money the last 3 times I've caught him (Ibiza Pacha 05 & Space 06 plus Circus_Liverpool a couple of weeks back) - this has been reflected in the awesome 2 and a bit hours of his Space set (that I specifically flew for last year and had the priveledge to see), and the recent Mumbai set. For some reason the quality productions JD plays out live seldom (if ever) hit his weekly Transitions show - which is fine, IF the music that replaces them is great (remember - JD has more access to new productions that most of the planet). Last weeks 1st hour was pretty darned good (if you discount the 1st track - the Gerber and Slacker were corkers and formed the body of his recently raved about Plattenger mix), the 30-mins of his 2nd shared hour were, frankly, shabby. I'd been playing the Beirut Forum set when I read the Ableton interview and a few thoughts sprang into my head that I thought I'd share with the [ms] crew.[/quote]
Because his shows are meant to showcase, not make you chairdance, hence why he's naming tracks during the show.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
You don't HAVE to live with anything. Just unplug. Go listen to some old cd's you haven't listened to in a year or more.
So digweed is doing his radio mixes with ableton...big deal. He's doing his job, bringing new music to people who might not ever hear these songs anyway else...and yeah there are a lot of shit tracks on there. But theres a lot of good stuff on there too. Ya just gotta sift through it.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
I've always been puzzled on why Ableton vs. cdj's/vinyl is such an issue :roll:
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
Wow, you guys are being pretty hard on Diggers:) . I just recently purchased the A&H Zone 3D mixer (which works in conjunciton with @Live). I will say it's been a pain in the arse to set up.:twisted:
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
[quote=simonr;459300]edit it down to make way for the really annoying Kiss100 Condom/safe-sex/drug awareness adds[/quote]
you forgot to mention those fucking ads about driving slowing so you dont kill babys... what if i drive fast just so i can kill babys
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
I am with simonr on this one , I am not a DJ and I don't know how to use abelton , but since Sasha started using it he lost his special touch that he had before , hence he is not my favourite DJ anymore , I don't how to explain this but you could feel when he plays his music that its not him but a machine that doesn't instead, Call me crazy but thats how I feel . Hope Digger stays the same and keep it old school , my 0.003461 cents.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
All I have to say is Sasha destroyed SF the last time he was here in November. His set even eclipsed Digweed's last set here.
I was blown away with what he was doing with Ableton. MUUUUUUUCH better than any of Sasha's radio sets.
I hope JD starts using it.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
yea i was there, that set was fucking off the hook
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
^ amen.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
I don't think Digweed is a big fan of using effects so he won't jump on the bandwagon anytime soon.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
Sasha didnt lose anything.. i dont know how he is playing when you see him, but las 2 times down here he was amazing and really dynamic.. at the point that the other djs sound boring because they let the full leght tracks without touching them.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
for how long this "issue" still going to be an issue, as if it makes any difference if you play a track with ableton, vinyl, or cd. the only difference i can find here is the quality sound if theres any, nothing much from that. Come on guys, havent seen a single "lee burridge-play vinyl-post" even thow he have changed his unique sound lately. So the only thing i have to say about this issue is: a brand new technologic tool is allways a good chance to improve the old stuff, even if music doesnt get any old, give it a chance.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
For me Sasha has been hit & miss with @live (I was there the last time he played of vinyl/CD at Space, and Zabiela reckons its the best he's seen him play). Initially the signs were good, his 2005 EM was fantastic as was his set later that day/night at Fabric (his last appearance before he allegedly fell out with the club) and his May'05 set at Circus(Liverpool) - this was on a par with Buenos Aires set with Diggers, and things seemed to be holding up. However a set that summer at Godkitchen was embarassingly bad (I'd persuaded pople to travel down) and a complete waste of money - everyones allowed a stinker, but to these ears he started to become very hit & miss. The Avalon Cd was pretty good and Sasha played a lot of that with Hernan at Pacha July 2006, which seemed a return to form (for 2 hours before he couldn't keep it of the Hour 3) .. but his Warehouse set in Manchester December 2006 was drab (even though he probably played a lot of that stuff in London the following week to rave reviews). The problem for me is that the stuff he's playing on Ableton lacks punch or depth (those Zouk and Zu House sets simply don't stand up on comparison to any of his pre 2005 stuff). The shame is that (i) he always always had a good ear for a production, whether it be progressive, dark, trancey or just beautiful and (ii) Sasha now has the opportunity to cart around and feature the years worth of awesome material he's collected. Its not about looking backwards, you can take technology forward and embrace it while still maintaining the artistic integrity of the music. Maybe its like a great guitar player switching to guitar-synth - there's a compromise in touch and tone.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
[quote=simonr;459616]For me Sasha has been hit & miss with @live (I was there the last time he played of vinyl/CD at Space, and Zabiela reckons its the best he's seen him play). Initially the signs were good, his 2005 EM was fantastic as was his set later that day/night at Fabric (his last appearance before he allegedly fell out with the club) and his May'05 set at Circus(Liverpool) - this was on a par with Buenos Aires set with Diggers, and things seemed to be holding up. However a set that summer at Godkitchen was embarassingly bad (I'd persuaded pople to travel down) and a complete waste of money - everyones allowed a stinker, but to these ears he started to become very hit & miss. The Avalon Cd was pretty good and Sasha played a lot of that with Hernan at Pacha July 2006, which seemed a return to form (for 2 hours before he couldn't keep it of the Hour 3) .. but his Warehouse set in Manchester December 2006 was drab (even though he probably played a lot of that stuff in London the following week to rave reviews). The problem for me is that the stuff he's playing on Ableton lacks punch or depth (those Zouk and Zu House sets simply don't stand up on comparison to any of his pre 2005 stuff). The shame is that (i) he always always had a good ear for a production, whether it be progressive, dark, trancey or just beautiful and (ii) Sasha now has the opportunity to cart around and feature the years worth of awesome material he's collected. Its not about looking backwards, you can take technology forward and embrace it while still maintaining the artistic integrity of the music. Maybe its like a great guitar player switching to guitar-synth - there's a compromise in touch and tone.[/quote]
i agree with somethings u said on that, but u have to say that he is only human
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
Thats a fair point red1 ... but he's a very talented one - unfortunately I can't remember the the last decent track Sasha played that made me want to race out and buy it (which for me, now sets the likes of Hernan, Digweed and Garcia ahead of the game) .. still - Mr Coe's very much entitled to change direction (as is Fortier - who I just don't dig that much these days either) . Ultimately people can vote with their feet (club-wise) or CD purchases (although I am looking forward to Fortier's artist album). Maybe I'm getting old fashioned and grumpy in my old age !
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
my personal opinion on sasha @ the mo is that he seems to be struggling with this whole minimal thing thats going on, sasha's always been a fashionable dj but like everyone else sometimes u just cant get into a sound......
personally i,ve used/ messed about with ableton recently and although i dont have many songs to play around with i have found more drawbacks with ableton than i have good points in a way, i would hate to use it live, well i say that now but maybe in a few months i may be saying something different but what i,m trying to say is that sometimes u feel like ur job is great and other times u just cant be bothered or just cant find the encouragement to perform to ur best, like i said, he's only human m8, music is an amazing way of expressing mood
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
Human? No way, not the Man Like :lol:
Too many DJs are too caught up with technology these days and lose sight of the sound. My problem with DJs who fuck around with tracks on Ableton or effects or CDJs is that too often, the elements added live ontop of the tracks overshadow the tracks themselves. All you need is something at the right place to accentuate a track, not butcher it live. If a DJ wants to fuck around with a track, remix it. Don't give me an epileptic fit on the dancefloor.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
its all about choice and prefferencies
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
[quote=jfthom5;459459]Wow, you guys are being pretty hard on Diggers:) . I just recently purchased the A&H Zone 3D mixer (which works in conjunciton with @Live). I will say it's been a pain in the arse to set up.:twisted:[/quote]
Wow. let us know about how you dig it when you get it all set up...i think it's pretty cool that there is basically a xone 92 in there with controllers on either side.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
[quote=feather;459560]I don't think Digweed is a big fan of using effects so he won't jump on the bandwagon anytime soon.[/quote]
i'm definitely with ya on that. The guy is simply a mixer and three cdj's. No need for effects.
Now me...I would love to get my hands on one of those EFX-1000's
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
[QUOTE=jeffrey collins;459683]i'm definitely with ya on that. The guy is simply a mixer and three cdj's. No need for effects.
Now me...I would love to get my hands on one of those EFX-1000's[/QUOTE]
He actually had the EFX-1000 running through the A&H Xone 92 on Friday @ Myth with 3 CDJ's. Though I didn't hear them being used more than maybe a handful of times.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
i never understood the need to edit and add efx to tracks. producers spend hours pooring over every tiny detail of there tracks.... why fuck it up? and if it needs fixing, dont play it. like james holden said, i dont want to ruin someones masterpiece...
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
^^^^^Very Very well said sir.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
+1
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
[QUOTE=ShawnD64;459710]i never understood the need to edit and add efx to tracks. producers spend hours pooring over every tiny detail of there tracks.... why fuck it up? and if it needs fixing, dont play it. like james holden said, i dont want to ruin someones masterpiece...[/QUOTE]
Couldn't have said it better myself!
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
[quote=ShawnD64;459710]i never understood the need to edit and add efx to tracks. producers spend hours pooring over every tiny detail of there tracks.... why fuck it up? and if it needs fixing, dont play it. like james holden said, i dont want to ruin someones masterpiece...[/quote]
James might be a great producer, but he's not all that much of a philosopher. It's not destroying someones track simply by re-editing it on the fly...it's customizing it for that performance. I'd feel like i didn't give my crowd their moneys worth if I didn't give them what they weren't getting from other dj's. I happen to love looping a certain part of a track and then dropping the original back in.
James shouldn't be one to talk about "fucking up" other peoples tracks. If you weren't for doing that. Thank you should stay your ass away from remixing altogether. As Isn't that the basis of remixing anyway?
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
Transitions has been shit for a while...sure there are [I]some[/I] cool tracks but most of the time it sounds like nails on a chalkboard type shit. Hernan Cattaneo has done his show using Ableton for a while now and its maintained its level of greatness imo. And btw what did djs use to put together their radio shows before Ableton? How did Digweed do it back in 2001 for example?
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
I personally dont care what tools a DJ chooses to use as long as the sound quality is maintained and my feet are moving.
My biggest problem with all the new DJ technology is the steady decline in the quality of audio. DJ's playing 192's or worse sometimes.
For example: DJ Sneak played here just this past week. It was an all CD set filled with great tracks and excellent mixing but..... sounded like total shit. Heavily compressed Mp3's are not meant for the club and I want to piss on DJ's that cant at least play 320's.
Vinyl will always be king imo and Im not trying to start a vinyl/digtal debate. I understand that downloading music and carrying a CD case with thousands of tracks is infinately more convenient than lugging heavy and cumbersome vinyl around. I just wish DJ's would have the courtesy to at least stick to 320's.
I feel like a DJ has no respect for the people who pay his bills when they play shitty Mp3's. I may have traveled some distance and payed good money to get in the door and the DJ cant even stick to 320's.....
piss on em
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
[quote=JK224;462880]Transitions has been shit for a while...sure there are [I]some[/I] cool tracks but most of the time it sounds like nails on a chalkboard type shit. Hernan Cattaneo has done his show using Ableton for a while now and its maintained its level of greatness imo. And btw what did djs use to put together their radio shows before Ableton? How did Digweed do it back in 2001 for example?[/quote]
digweed used to mix all the kiss shows every damned week. i remember sets that actually had minor mistakes (gasp!) in them. it was great...and i miss those days, but i can totally understand why he has gone that way with his shows and no one here can possibly justify looking down on him for it.
and just cause you don't like the new transitions, does NOT mean they're bad. they're fucking fantastic, in my opinion. digweed still really cares about the music, and it shows.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
[QUOTE=day_for_night;462889]digweed used to mix all the kiss shows every damned week. i remember sets that actually had minor mistakes (gasp!) in them. it was great...and i miss those days, but i can totally understand why he has gone that way with his shows and no one here can possibly justify looking down on him for it.[/QUOTE]
Digweed's KISS show used to be almost entirely comprised of sections of his live shows. He didn't mix them in the studio, he just did voiceovers with track names and such.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
[quote=ShawnD64;459710]i never understood the need to edit and add efx to tracks. producers spend hours pooring over every tiny detail of there tracks.... why fuck it up? and if it needs fixing, dont play it. like james holden said, i dont want to ruin someones masterpiece...[/quote]
That's like saying I shouldn't put mods on my car. But in the end, there's always a little something that can be done to enhance a piece. It allows for the listener to add their own interpretation of the tracks.
Re: What Diggers didn't say about Ableton.
ill always enjoy solid track selection over some gay ass on the fly loop, but i guess thats just me..rember the show is called transitions, its not about the dj its about the tracks